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Old 01-27-2005, 08:44 PM   #46
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paul really how so? christ is the object of more books,music, and litruture then any other individual.Jeus of nazareth is unpararlleled as a humanitarian influence. more hospitals, orphanages,rest homes,and rescue missions have beeen dedicated to HIm than all the religous leader combined.IN the last two thousand years he has promoted greater commitment among his followers then any other idividual.
Yes... because of Paul. Do you know how far Paul went to teach the message of Jesus? Peter and his gang were only willing to teach the Jews. Paul took the message to the "center of the world", to all the Gentiles. Paul is the reason we know who Christ is.

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Old 01-27-2005, 08:46 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by grand_master_d
Yes... because of Paul. Do you know how far Paul went to teach the message of Jesus? Peter and his gang were only willing to teach the Jews. Paul took the message to the "center of the world", to all the Gentiles. Paul is the reason we know who Christ is.
but with out christ he wuld have had nothing to teach
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Old 01-27-2005, 08:47 PM   #48
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but with out christ he wuld have had nothing to teach
Which is not the point.
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"A six-week trial over the issue yielded 'overwhelming evidence' establishing that intelligent design 'is a religious view, a mere re-labeling of creationism, and not a scientific theory,' said Jones, a Republican and a churchgoer appointed to the federal bench three years ago."

"People gave ear to an upstart astrologer who strove to show that the earth revolves, not the heavens or the firmament, the sun and the moon…. This fool wishes to reverse the entire science of astronomy; but sacred scripture tells us that Joshua commanded the sun to stand still, and not the earth."
-Martin Luther

"Those who assert that 'the earth moves and turns'...[are] motivated by 'a spirit of bitterness, contradiction, and faultfinding;' possessed by the devil, they aimed 'to pervert the order of nature.'"
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Old 01-27-2005, 08:53 PM   #49
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Which is not the point.
so your telling me you think paul was more influentual then Jesus but He was influetual because of JESUS
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Old 01-27-2005, 09:00 PM   #50
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so your telling me you think paul was more influentual then Jesus but He was influetual because of JESUS
I don't care who Paul was influenced by. The fact that he took Christianity to the next level (hell, he invented Christianity), is proof that he was more influential 2,000 years ago. Jesus hung out in his own little "corner" of the world. Paul went to every known part of the world, getting followers of every race, age, sex...

You can say Jesus was the "better" person. That's great and fine. But, once again, Paul is the reason you know who Jesus is.
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"A six-week trial over the issue yielded 'overwhelming evidence' establishing that intelligent design 'is a religious view, a mere re-labeling of creationism, and not a scientific theory,' said Jones, a Republican and a churchgoer appointed to the federal bench three years ago."

"People gave ear to an upstart astrologer who strove to show that the earth revolves, not the heavens or the firmament, the sun and the moon…. This fool wishes to reverse the entire science of astronomy; but sacred scripture tells us that Joshua commanded the sun to stand still, and not the earth."
-Martin Luther

"Those who assert that 'the earth moves and turns'...[are] motivated by 'a spirit of bitterness, contradiction, and faultfinding;' possessed by the devil, they aimed 'to pervert the order of nature.'"
-John Calvin
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Old 01-27-2005, 09:03 PM   #51
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Quote:
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I don't care who Paul was influenced by. The fact that he took Christianity to the next level (hell, he invented Christianity), is proof that he was more influential 2,000 years ago. Jesus hung out in his own little "corner" of the world. Paul went to every known part of the world, getting followers of every race, age, sex...

You can say Jesus was the "better" person. That's great and fine. But, once again, Paul is the reason you know who Jesus is.
but ahh i cant exlpian so just forget it im not going to argue over this with you
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Old 01-27-2005, 09:09 PM   #52
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paul really how so? christ is the object of more books,music, and litruture then any other individual.Jeus of nazareth is unpararlleled as a humanitarian influence. more hospitals, orphanages,rest homes,and rescue missions have beeen dedicated to HIm than all the religous leader combined.
This isn't even true. He may be the most popular, but he's not more popular than all the other ones combined.

I also don't see how this has anything to do with Jesus' actual influence. I do not believe Jesus is responsible for making people dedicate things in his name, in the same way I do not believe Shiva is responsible for making people dedicate things in his name.
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Old 01-27-2005, 09:16 PM   #53
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but with out christ he wuld have had nothing to teach
I don't think Paul based his teachings on Jesus at all. I think Paul is a charlatan who capitalized on the fact that people were upset with their supposed Messiah getting crucified, who crafted his own entirely new religion out ideas he got from various ressurection cults (Osiris, Persephone) floating around Greece and Rome and Judea. Paul's religion is almost entirely focused on Jesus' death and supposed resurrection, not what Jesus actually said. (And if we believe the gospels are an accurate record of what Jesus said then there are plenty of contradictions between what Paul teaches and what Jesus teaches).

Jesus (assuming he existed) probably had a large following. His following would have dispersed and been forgotten in history after he got crucified, were it not for Paul. Paul also made his own form of Christianity (if Christianity existed that early) distinctive and separate from all the other ones floating around, like the mysterious Christians who Paul gets so mad at for trying to convert the Galatians to a different gospel than his. Paul, through his rhetoric, managed to make his Christianity authoritative.

This feat was only surpassed later by Constantine, who made Christianity even more widespread by making it the official religion of the Roman empire -- and more importantly, by creating the Bible. Before Constantine, there was no Bible, there was no canon. Moreso than Paul, Constantine consolidated the various sects of Christianity and created the authoritative version.

Apparently all Jesus did was amass a bunch of followers and really piss off some Jews.
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Old 01-27-2005, 09:34 PM   #54
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Apparently all Jesus did was amass a bunch of followers and really piss off some Jews.[/QUOTE]

wow is that realy what you think if they mmade up this religion then why would pual have died for it why would Christ have died for it if it was something just made up
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Old 01-27-2005, 10:07 PM   #55
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wow is that realy what you think if they mmade up this religion then why would pual have died for it why would Christ have died for it if it was something just made up
You don't think people have died for all the other religions you don't believe in?
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