[FreakShiny]

I have been wanting to learn how to 'shred' for a while now... I am told to learn pentatonic scales. I found many sites with the scales but none of which tell how to play them or how to practice with them.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

[lopar]

*braces self for 8-page dissertation (with cool words like 'ergo') by chesh about FBLSE*

[Nate]

I'm not sure what pentatonic scales have to do with shredding, but in any event:

It's hard to go wrong with the pentatonic scales. Regardless of your chord progression (providing all the chords are in-key chords), you can basically play anything you want from the corresponding pentatonic scale and have it sound good. This makes it pretty easy to practice playing the pentatonic scales. Record yourself playing a basic chord progression, or have a buddy come over and jam with you... then just start messing around with the pentatonic scales over the progression. Play them forwards, backwards, skipping around, up and down the length of the neck, etc, etc, etc. You don't really have to worry about anything not sounding good or not fitting with the music, 'cause that's almost impossible to do with the pentatonic scales. Just play around, and eventually you'll begin to develop a feel for how to use pentatonic scales effectively.

Now, how to apply all that to shredding? I have no idea.

In His love,
Nate

[IceHawk]

Originally Posted by lopar

*braces self for 8-page dissertation (with cool words like 'ergo') by chesh about FBLSE*

haha...

not many tips on shredding. Get tabs for that style and practice, practice, and practice some more until you get it right.

[agrimes87]

Tips for shredding?

Well, shredding is really just hitting a big range of notes really fast. If not a big range, at least a big amount, with a moderate range.

First of all, you're going to want to know more than just the pentatonic scales. They're common because they're the simplest forms typically used. But first of all, you're going to have to know them up and down the fretboard, and you're going to have to be able to connect them horizontally just as well as you can vertically.

Practice your picking hand; speed, string-skipping, different pick angles, different up-down patterns, etc. Practice versatility on you fretting hand (basically, practice everything); speed, vertical flow, horizontal flow, barring, pinkie finger (it's surprisingly common for the pinkie to be incredibly unpracticed), etc.

Also, try techniques like sweeping, tapping, harmonics, legato, tremolo, pedal tones, wah, etc.

The wah pedal makes you sound a lot faster, and sweeping, well, it's really fast. lol. Legato lets you hit a lot of notes with incredible pick-hand efficiency (sweeping does that too).

All of these things you're going to want to practice like you're mad.

You might also want to try and figure out some little patterns that are easy to play, and sound really fast. Here's one:

|---------------------------------10-12-15
|-----------------------8--10-12----------
|------------------7-9--------------------
|------------5-7-9------------------------
|------3-5-7------------------------------
|-3-5-------------------------------------

You can move that around wherever, and play around with it. It's a good legato practice pattern, as well as tapping, and horizontal flow.


p.s. Arpeggios arpeggios arpeggios!!!! Practice the patterns everywhere. They're JUST as important as pentatonics when it comes to shredding. ESPECIALLY sweeping....heed my words. lol.

[CheshireCat]

Originally Posted by lopar

*braces self for 8-page dissertation (with cool words like 'ergo') by chesh about FBLSE*

Eh, well, the short version is get Fretboard Logic SE, and that will teach you to do what Grimes said, which is to . . .

know them up and down the fretboard, and you're going to have to be able to connect them horizontally just as well as you can vertically

. . . in terms of pentatonic scales along with everything else.

The important thing is to be able to shred with just basic notes and basic fretting, before getting into all manner of articulation. If you can't shred with straightforward picking, you won't be able to shred whilst tapping, sweeping, and so on.

Also, another very important point: shredding is simply a tool for storytelling - nothing more; nothing less. It's kinda like what George Lucas said about special effects. "A special effect is simply a tool to tell a story. I needs to have the realism that the actor brings to it. Devoid of that, a special effect is a pretty boring thing."

Same thing with shredding. It is simply a tool for storytelling. Devoid of a story, it is pretty boring. Case in point: Yngwie Malmsteen's career. Sure, he's respected as a guitar playing precisely for his shredding capabilities, but he is wholly and completely disregarded on many fronts because he isn't a storyteller. You really don't hear a lot of people humming his tunes because he doesn't have any tunes, just demostrations of his skills in shredding loosely dressed up as "songs".

Ozzy Osbourne, on the other hand, is a tremendous storyteller. He has a very strong sense of story, narrative, pacing, light and shadow, and progression. With each of his songs you as the listener take a journey. That's the reason why he has had such a phenomenal career for over 30 years. That's also why his songs still get regular rotation on the radio, and crosslistening on several different formats at that, from classic rock to hard rock and then some others as well.

So, as in the case of Randy Rhoads, Ozzy's first guitarist as a solo artist, Rhoads is a phenomenal shredder, and actually created a lot of the modern day shredder's palette, but he used it only as a tool, and very often only one of many in any given song. He was also classically trained, and approached all of his guitar playing from that standpoint. As a result, he was just as comfortable and versatile playing slower, more methodical passages, as he was playing fast ones, and never had to ramp up for anything fast for that matter. He just took off when appropriate, going at breakneck speeds, and then dropping tempo when the shredding bit was over. That simple and clean.

Focus on being a storyteller first, and then where appropriate, breakout and shred.

Chesh

[lopar]

Originally Posted by CheshireCat

Eh, well, the short version is get Fretboard Logic SE, and that will teach you to do what Grimes said, which is to . . .

I actually really enjoy reading your 'dissertations,' don't worry, keep writing em!

[agrimes87]

Originally Posted by CheshireCat

Focus on being a storyteller first, and then where appropriate, breakout and shred.

Chesh

But in the mean time, it might be a good idea to actually learn how to shred, forgetting the story-telling stuff. 'Cause after all, you can't really tell a story with shredding if you don't know how. Get the technique, then use it. You can't really do it the other way around.

Being melodic is great, but my advice would be to work on technique before you start working on story-telling (unless you want to try and do both at the same time). Story telling is definitely important, but I'd wait until I was a versatile guitarist before I started trying to tell stories. Expand your boundaries; your abilities; your techniques...then, forget about them. Try and make music then, and you'll find that you have the ability to play the things you hear in your head; the things you want. If you try and do it the other way around, you're going to get frustrated. You'll hear this great solo in your head, and you'll want to play it so badly, but you just won't be able to.

[apologia]

I am told to learn pentatonic scales

long-live the 70's guitarists.

I have been wanting to learn how to 'shred' for a while now... I am told to learn pentatonic scales

I find that weird since 'most' shredders would not use the pentatonic scale.

Practice your picking hand; speed, string-skipping, different pick angles, different up-down patterns, etc. Practice versatility on you fretting hand (basically, practice everything); speed, vertical flow, horizontal flow, barring, pinkie finger (it's surprisingly common for the pinkie to be incredibly unpracticed), etc.

Most importantly, practice your precision. Most early shredders would learn to play really fast but their notes are not clear or not in time. This may impress non-guitarist, but in front of other shredders you won't be considered very good. To make sure you are precise, start slow. Practise it until you can play it with ease. Then increase your speed. Also remember to use the metronome.(I'm guilty here as well.) And remember, oddly enough, in shredding precision is first, then speed.

If you want to create your own shredding solos, do what agrimes said, play around with your scales. Besides that, practice shred licks from all over the place.

Here is one in pentatonic :

------------------------------------------------------------------------12
--------------------------------------------------------12----12151215---
----------------------------------------12----12141214----14------------
-------------------------12----12141214---14----------------------------
----------12----12141214---14-------------------------------------------
-12151215---15----------------------------------------------------------

----12-12/15b
-15----12/15b
--------------
--------------
--------------
--------------

ANyway here is a site on shredding www.insaneguitar.com which would cover all the basic techniques.

[FreakShiny]

Sweet! Thanks for all of the help, guys. I have a kid in the youth group I lead who is in a band and plays lead guitar -- he is giving me some tips as well. He has pretty much said the same thing about pentatonics -- that they are pointless in terms of both lead and shredding. He did reiterate, however, the importance that pentatonics can play in overall technique and style.

I am self-taught with the guitar -- I can rip out plenty of rhythm riffs in rock, punk, and metal but I am lacking in the lead department. Lead guitar just looks so fun to play! Perhaps I should focus on learning lead first and how to shred later.

[agrimes87]

Originally Posted by FreakShiny

Perhaps I should focus on learning lead first and how to shred later.

Yeah, that's definitely a given.

[apologia]

He has pretty much said the same thing about pentatonics -- that they are pointless in terms of both lead and shredding.

Not nesecarrily true, you must remember that stairway to heaven is based on the pentatonic scale. Then again, some ppl say that that solo is just crap.