LOST

rockin4theking · 02-12-2005, 11:13 AM

I hate to be a blasphemer, but what does everybody think about Charlie pretty much being a scumbag before he got to the island? Ya'll seem to adore him and hate Sawyer, yet they have remarkably similar backgrounds (minus the band bit).

I think that Sawyer is going to be a big part of the plot in the near future.

rocker_chick · 02-12-2005, 11:16 AM

ya i can definetly agree with u there about sawyer but the reason i like charlie is cause he cleaned up sawyer is still a jerk

rocker_chick · 02-12-2005, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocker_chick

ya i can definetly agree with u there about sawyer but the reason i like charlie is cause he cleaned up sawyer is still a jerk

.... and he is HOTT

rockin4theking · 02-12-2005, 11:23 AM

So Charlie killing Ethan in cold blood is somehow glossed over? His rampant mood swings and obsessive traits are just overlooked? Interesting.

Sawyer has been a jerk, but he's always seemed to be looking out for number one, which given his history and situation is very understandable. He has done very little to harm others. In fact, I'd say that a good part of his being a jerk is due to how the others treat him. When they treat him decently he acts in kind. Think about it...

**mtlmouth** · 02-12-2005, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocker_chick

ok dominic Monaghan (charlie) is being hinted as to going out with the chick that plays Kate. noone knows for sure but there is evidence.
*cries*

I heard about that. That's funny... I bet you're REALLY jealous of her now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockin4theking

I hate to be a blasphemer, but what does everybody think about Charlie pretty much being a scumbag before he got to the island? Ya'll seem to adore him and hate Sawyer, yet they have remarkably similar backgrounds (minus the band bit).

I think that Sawyer is going to be a big part of the plot in the near future.

Okay, so he was messed up on drugs. But he's cleaned up. I didn't say I liked who he was before the crash. But he's changed a lot since then.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocker_chick

ya i can definetly agree with u there about sawyer but the reason i like charlie is cause he cleaned up sawyer is still a jerk

Or I could have just copied what Izzy said...

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocker_chick

.... and he is HOTT

Actually, I take back my last statement...

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockin4theking

So Charlie killing Ethan in cold blood is somehow glossed over? His rampant mood swings and obsessive traits are just overlooked? Interesting.

Sawyer has been a jerk, but he's always seemed to be looking out for number one, which given his history and situation is very understandable. He has done very little to harm others. In fact, I'd say that a good part of his being a jerk is due to how the others treat him. When they treat him decently he acts in kind. Think about it...

I don't think the castaways would have gotten anything out of Ethan. Leaving him in the jungle to continue to wreak havoc would have been bad. If they took him captive, it wouldn't have been very practical because he's so clever- he would have gotten away, escaped to the jungle and continued to be a hazard to the rest of the castaways.
As for Sawyer, he's an egotistical jerk. Sure, this matches his personality. Maybe it's because Charlie has changed a lot since before the crash, while Sawyer is the same (except now he has Kate

). He hasn't harmed the castaways, but he certainly didn't do much to help. Sure, his most personable moment was when Hurley just asked him to give him the manifest. But the fact that he's been selfish the whole time on the island has led everyone to have to result to drastic measures.
So, I suppose I have a harder time justifying my choice of favorites than Izzy, who can just say "It's cause Charlie's hot". Not sharing this viewpoint (sorry, Izzy), my reasoning is just because I prefer certain characters over others. I'm going to favor a former rock star, a personable overweight guy and a pregnant lady over an ex-con.

There's my Lost novel of the day.

rockin4theking · 02-12-2005, 11:57 AM

I can see why everybody hates Sawyer; he is the "unlikeable" guy after all. But Charlie isn't all that much better. Why has he gotten clean? Because he has no drugs. He has changed, but he still has a dark side to him that I think will make for some interesting viewing in the future. Example: what would he do if his (and Claire's) interests would put the others in immediate danger? I.e. in order for him to keep Claire "safe" (as he percieves it, not like the last episode where she was in danger, but rather in a situation where Charlie merely thinks that she's in danger) he has to sacrifice one of the others? I think he would do it.

Sawyer? I think I could see him sacrificing himself for the others. Charlie... maybe not.

Quick edit:

Look at how the others have tried to get Sawyer to help them... browbeating seldom helps anyone, and the times they have just dealt with his little games, he's done what they asked with little trouble.

rocker_chick · 02-12-2005, 12:22 PM

U know what i dont get is why we are debating this casue everyone has their won opinion of the show everyone likes there own characters, so THIS IS THE END OF THE ARGUMENT

rockin4theking · 02-12-2005, 12:36 PM

I am talking about this because this thread has deteriorated into a state of near-CPF quality drivel. I am talking about this because it is interesting to talk about character development, motives, traits, and the like. It is not a debate, and I'm tired of people making non-sensical posts like this:

OMG charly is soooooooo HOTT!!!1!!!1 iwan't sawyyer to die h eis soo a jerk!!11! its lkie 12 huors utnil LOST ison teeveee!!!1!!1!!1

C'mon people.

**mtlmouth** · 02-12-2005, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockin4theking

I am talking about this because this thread has deteriorated into a state of near-CPF quality drivel. I am talking about this because it is interesting to talk about character development, motives, traits, and the like. It is not a debate, and I'm tired of people making non-sensical posts like this:

OMG charly is soooooooo HOTT!!!1!!!1 iwan't sawyyer to die h eis soo a jerk!!11! its lkie 12 huors utnil LOST ison teeveee!!!1!!1!!1

C'mon people.

All right, first off, after three weeks of "Does Walt have the ability to make things happen?", "Is Claire still pregnant?" and "Oh, my gosh, didn't you just LOVE that scene where Charlie was trying not to read her diary?!", Kaleigh (Purple Girl) and I ran out of things to talk about other than anticipating the next episode. However, she will not be online until Wednesday morning, so I can guarentee this will not happen again this week.
Yes, it is good to have discussions about character development and such. However, I think you're beating a dead horse. Furthermore, I think that perhaps we're all a bit biased since this is Christian Guitar Resources (and most of us would say that music is very important to him/her) and Charlie is the rock star. Just a theory, I could be completely off. Also, Izzy is the only one here who is making comments about how hot Charlie is. I personally think he looks like a hobbit, but we all have our own preferences and I'm not thinking any less of anyone for their taste.
You do have a point about how he could overreact while trying to keep Claire 'safe'. I think it was smart of Jack, Locke and Sayid not to give him a gun, however, I don't think Sawyer was a great choice either (how about Boone? Michael?).
We all have our favorites for various reasons, and most of the time we can't pick who we like. Sawyer is the character we love to hate- the viewers acknowledge this, as well as the producers and the actor that plays him. Certain characters on this show are made to be more likeable than others. Your choice of favorites is up to you.
But check your UCs.

rockin4theking · 02-12-2005, 02:04 PM

Fine. Have it your way. Here I am trying to spark some intellectual discussion and you guys react like I hit you with a stick.

If you just want to leave it at "I like who I like because I do" then so be it. I just thought that maybe a little discussion of why the characters are like they are, how we view them, and how we associate with them would be good. I can see that was not the case.

Cheers.

Justin

**mtlmouth** · 02-12-2005, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockin4theking

Fine. Have it your way. Here I am trying to spark some intellectual discussion and you guys react like I hit you with a stick.

If you just want to leave it at "I like who I like because I do" then so be it. I just thought that maybe a little discussion of why the characters are like they are, how we view them, and how we associate with them would be good. I can see that was not the case.

Cheers.

Justin

I'm all for intellectual discussion about the characters. However, I just don't think that your particular point of "Why do you all hate Sawyer but love Charlie, since they've got such similiar backgrounds?" isn't going to go anywhere, because personally I don't think that they have all that much in common. I love any kind of discussion about Lost- that's pretty much all that's talked about in my house for the better part of Thursday, it seems (maybe because I keep bringing it up?). But you seem to keep bringing the same point up. I don't think that this qualifies as 'intellectual discussion'.
-Taylor

rocker_chick · 02-12-2005, 02:30 PM

I have to agree that the how would not be the same without sawyer, and yes i did make a comment about Charlies looks but that is not just why i like him. It took alot for him to quit dugs nad he has changed alot there are things we like baout characters nad thing we dont,that is our own perseption, but we can choose to like another character more than the other and still like the show with all the characters. You cant just base the reason you watch a show on one character and if we did that then we would not be having this conversation

rockin4theking · 02-12-2005, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mtlmouth

However, I just don't think that your particular point of "Why do you all hate Sawyer but love Charlie, since they've got such similiar backgrounds?" isn't going to go anywhere, because personally I don't think that they have all that much in common.

...

But you seem to keep bringing the same point up. I don't think that this qualifies as 'intellectual discussion'.
-Taylor

Man, you are overreacting now. I mentioned it twice to see if I could get a better answer than I did the first time.

My question was honestly why do you two hate on Sawyer while you love Charlie (who is now a cold-blooded murderer by the way). The answer I got was a) Because Sawyer is a jerk, b) Because Charlie is hot, and c) Because Charlie has "cleaned up" in the very short time they've been on the island.

Since that seems to be the only answer I'm going to get, and people are getting upset about my asking why exactly they hate one and love the other, I'll stop now.

**mtlmouth** · 02-12-2005, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocker_chick

I have to agree that the how would not be the same without sawyer, and yes i did make a comment about Charlies looks but that is not just why i like him. It took alot for him to quit dugs nad he has changed alot there are things we like baout characters nad thing we dont,that is our own perseption, but we can choose to like another character more than the other and still like the show with all the characters. You cant just base the reason you watch a show on one character and if we did that then we would not be having this conversation

Well put. Sawyer is an important character and is interesting, but that doesn't mean I have to like him. Charlie's character is interesting as well- he's been through a lot and was pretty messed up for a while, but (unlike Sawyer) has turned around and become a pretty nice guy (plus he gets a lot of good one-liners). All the characters are important to the series as a whole, (most of them, anyway, I think I could do without Shannon and/or Boone) and it's kind of silly to pick favorites, when you think about it. However, that doesn't change the fact that I still prefer a more personable character to an ego-centric one, just like I do with people in real life. Think of this: If YOU were one of the 48 survivors of the crash, which character(s) would you prefer to spend time with? I don't know about you, but I'd stay far away from Sawyer.

rockin4theking · 02-12-2005, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocker_chick

I have to agree that the how would not be the same without sawyer, and yes i did make a comment about Charlies looks but that is not just why i like him. It took alot for him to quit dugs nad he has changed alot there are things we like baout characters nad thing we dont,that is our own perseption, but we can choose to like another character more than the other and still like the show with all the characters. You cant just base the reason you watch a show on one character and if we did that then we would not be having this conversation

Several quick things:

1) Charlie quit drugs because he ran out, not neccesarily because he wanted to. His getting off them has made him a better person, for now.

2) I'm not saying you can't like any one character more than another; I'm just asking why, as people seem to be fairly vehement about it.

3) I like Charlie too, only I see him as being a fairly "dark" character like Sawyer, and not the lovable goof you folks do. I like all the characters for what they are and how they contribute to the storyline, not what I "like" about them. Without any of the main characters the show wouldn't be as good.