Nader?

**Mr.Zachcore** · 09-22-2004, 06:57 PM

I wacthed him on CSPAN last night and a lot of what he said about health care and employemnt really struck with me. I am really inclined to vote for him except he supports Gay marriage. Now as I see Constitutionally, that can't be stopped unless we infringe upon some rights.

but that is another discussion.

What I am asking is, is there another candidate like Nader who is anti-gay amrriage but for healthcare for all?

JerryLove · 09-22-2004, 07:09 PM

Which would you vote for: Bush or Kerry.

Whichever you choose, a choice to vote fot Nader is simply depriving that candidate of a vote.

If Nader had not run last election, we would know how Gore handled 9/11.

**Mr.Zachcore** · 09-22-2004, 08:35 PM

I wouldn't vote for either of them. But I do see your point.

**Epaphras** · 09-22-2004, 08:42 PM

Pro-gay marriage =

Pro-abortion =

therefore...

Nader =

guitarmonkey<>< · 09-22-2004, 08:57 PM

I really dont agree about healthcare for all..
1) Look at Canada and Russia, They Have Free Health Care...But People Wait up to 4 Mnths to get in, and the hospitals, ARE NOT nearly as advanced as ours. In Fact People come down From canada just to get treated here.

2) there Should Be a policy though, for minoritys, and people who flat out can not afford it should be helped out, (i know i was in those shoes), And the Law about having to save a life even if the family cant afford the op. should be stressed much more.

And For Once in I aggree whole heartedly, with Jerry, A vote for Nader is a taken From Bush, Or Kerry. NAder is not going to win... HE thinks he is but he will not, Look what happend with Bob Dole, A lot of Republicans, voted for him, and Clinton Got Into office.

grand_master_d · 09-22-2004, 10:15 PM

Free health care will only lessen the quality of our health care. With no profit, the incentive is no longer there to find cures. Though I don't plan on looking for sources right now, Jerry, most people with AIDS would rather see privatized health care...

Besides, we'd all be getting the **** taxed out of us...

Qingu · 09-22-2004, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grand_master_d

Free health care will only lessen the quality of our health care. With no profit, the incentive is no longer there to find cures. Though I don't plan on looking for sources right now, Jerry, most people with AIDS would rather see privatized health care...

Besides, we'd all be getting the **** taxed out of us...

Most people like me, who do not have health care, would rather have collective health care.

Of course, I'm moving to Canada.....

grand_master_d · 09-22-2004, 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Qingu

Most people like me, who do not have health care, would rather have collective health care.

Of course, I'm moving to Canada.....

Hell, I don't even know if I have health care or not. I don't live at home, and I file independent, so I'm sure I'm not on my parents. I guess I could use my school's health services... those are awesome, I'm sure.

Regardless, it's my responsibility. I'd rather get it myself, and get quality health care at that.

guitarmonkey<>< · 09-22-2004, 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Qingu

Most people like me, who do not have health care, would rather have collective health care.

Of course, I'm moving to Canada.....

Most people? Thats a pretty strong statement huh?

**Mr.Zachcore** · 09-23-2004, 08:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grand_master_d

Free health care will only lessen the quality of our health care. With no profit, the incentive is no longer there to find cures. Though I don't plan on looking for sources right now, Jerry, most people with AIDS would rather see privatized health care...

Besides, we'd all be getting the **** taxed out of us...

That makes me want to vomit. So youa re telling me people have no humanity in them to find cures for people because they need help? If that is the case, I have lost all faith in humans because they are all disgusting fools who care only about a couple of freakin greenbacks.

JerryLove · 09-23-2004, 08:51 AM

Quote:

1) Look at Canada and Russia, They Have Free Health Care...But People Wait up to 4 Mnths to get in, and the hospitals, ARE NOT nearly as advanced as ours. In Fact People come down From canada just to get treated here.

Socialized medicine offers generally better healtcare while capitalist healthare offers specifically better healthcare. America's wealthy get some of the best healtcare in the world, but the average level of healthcare is higher in Canada.

Much of your analogy is either out-of-date, or simply ignores who and why. I suppose I could point out how the US is tring to shut down people going to cnada to buy medication?

Quote:

2) there Should Be a policy though, for minoritys, and people who flat out can not afford it should be helped out, (i know i was in those shoes)

There should be a policy for minorities? Do you find that you don't like burning the cross at your rally because it's sacreligious? Or does it make a nice warm heat?

Quote:

And the Law about having to save a life even if the family cant afford the op. should be stressed much more.

I don't believe there are signifigant breeches of it.

Quote:

Free health care will only lessen the quality of our health care. With no profit, the incentive is no longer there to find cures.

Then why does Canada, with socialize healtcare, have a higher standard of healtcare than we do?

Quote:

Though I don't plan on looking for sources right now, Jerry, most people with AIDS would rather see privatized health care...

Not only would this be an "appeal to popularity", I simply don't believe you.

Quote:

Besides, we'd all be getting the **** taxed out of us...

I'm currently in collections for about $10,000 over medical bills... and I have good insurance. I think I'll take the tax, thanks.

Quote:

Hell, I don't even know if I have health care or not. I don't live at home, and I file independent, so I'm sure I'm not on my parents. I guess I could use my school's health services... those are awesome, I'm sure.

Get cancer and then get back with us.

Quote:

That makes me want to vomit. So youa re telling me people have no humanity in them to find cures for people because they need help? If that is the case, I have lost all faith in humans because they are all disgusting fools who care only about a couple of freakin greenbacks.

He's going for the "scare vote"... much like Cheney's "elect Bush or your family will die a horrible death", he's poffering "Keep capitalized healthcare or you will die from Alzheimers". He ignores that many of the great cures, and the pharmicutical companies that make them are in countries with socialized healthcare.

Qingu · 09-23-2004, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr.Zachcore

That makes me want to vomit. So youa re telling me people have no humanity in them to find cures for people because they need help? If that is the case, I have lost all faith in humans because they are all disgusting fools who care only about a couple of freakin greenbacks.

Unfortunately, he is right. Medical care is far superior in countries where competition is encouraged ... nothing like good ol' fashioned capitalism to fuel quality of services.

The problem is that I do not believe a person's medical care should be contingent on whether or not they can afford it.

I think the key is finding ways to have socialist-style universal health care while encouraging competition within the government-backed system. Obviously this is tricky, and so far no socialist system of health care has been able to match America's; nevertheless, I would rather live in a country where I am entitled to medical care on account of being alive (Canada) rather than on account of me being wealthy (America).

Right now, the difference between the two countries is: in Canada, if you're really, really sick, you're screwed. In America, if you're poor, you're screwed.

Qingu · 09-23-2004, 08:57 AM

Jerry, do you want to join my move-to-Canada club? I call it "Exodus."

grand_master_d · 09-23-2004, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JerryLove

He's going for the "scare vote"... much like Cheney's "elect Bush or your family will die a horrible death", he's poffering "Keep capitalized healthcare or you will die from Alzheimers". He ignores that many of the great cures, and the pharmicutical companies that make them are in countries with socialized healthcare.

Thanks for trying... but no. I'm not going for the "scare vote". Vote for whoever the **** you want to! Stop being an _______ please. I will not respond to someone who cannot act at least half civil.

Besides, last I checked, Kerry was going for the scare vote with his new "draft" approach. Lies...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Zachcore

That makes me want to vomit. So youa re telling me people have no humanity in them to find cures for people because they need help? If that is the case, I have lost all faith in humans because they are all disgusting fools who care only about a couple of freakin greenbacks.

Well you better go find a toilet. Do you really need me to tell you people have no humanity? Besides, did I ever say it was right? Moral? EVER?!?! Did I say that? I'm sorry, but that's just how things are.

Thanks Qingu, we can disagree and still get along!

guitarmonkey<>< · 09-23-2004, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Then why does Canada, with socialize healtcare, have a higher standard of healtcare than we do?

Have you seen a picture of a Standard Canada Op. Room....
Look at Russia, Free Health Care Doesnt Work.

As For the Burning "Cross" Statement, what the hell was that about, that had absolutely NOTHING to do with what i was saying,

And Mr. Zachcore, Believe it or not it takes money to do research.
If there is no money, no research, no cures.