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Unread 07-18-2014, 09:25 PM   #211
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Haha

It's really kind of weird to read. I agree with what I was saying. I agree with my reasoning. Just I said it in such an abrasive way. I actually remember this discussion.

Maybe I should go back and re-read a bunch threads to see all the people I need to apologize to.
I've gone back and read some of my early posts a couple times... sometimes it makes me shudder. Other times I wish I could just travel back in time and teach back then me how to have a regular discussion without coming across like a jerk.

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Unread 07-21-2014, 07:08 PM   #212
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Haha

It's really kind of weird to read. I agree with what I was saying. I agree with my reasoning. Just I said it in such an abrasive way. I actually remember this discussion.

Maybe I should go back and re-read a bunch threads to see all the people I need to apologize to.
Don't do it man, my list would be longer than this thread, I just assume/hope most people have forgotten. I saw an altercation between you and I from years ago, man, it wasn't pleasant. Now I find you to be pretty cool. I just chalk it up to us being really passionate and not as adept at explaining our passion in our youth. I still get like that, but I try to tone it down now, even if often it's to poor efect.
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Unread 07-29-2014, 06:48 PM   #213
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I definitely have a problem with "What Does The Fox Say."
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Unread 07-29-2014, 07:16 PM   #214
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I definitely have a problem with "What Does The Fox Say."
On what theological grounds?
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Unread 07-30-2014, 07:10 AM   #215
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To not be totally off subject...

Besides Jesus Culture, most worship music is doing a better job of avoiding heresy and blatantly stupid lyrics. They're still in general too shallow, lack originality, and derivative of one another, but I don't find myself thinking, "That's a really dumb song" nearly as often as I used to.

Now Jesus Culture on the other hand....they're pretty consistently both goofy and wacky with their lyrics. Of course I also have personal reasons to be skeptical of them. One of my biggest pastoral regrets was writing a letter of recommendation for a student to attend the school of witchcraft Jesus Culture is associated with. I didn't do enough research into it, and it very quickly messed her up. ...that and I've seen the YouTube videos of "Glory clouds" forming during their worship services. As it turns out "Glory clouds" look an awful lot like gold glitter being dumped from the rafters.

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Don't do it man, my list would be longer than this thread, I just assume/hope most people have forgotten. I saw an altercation between you and I from years ago, man, it wasn't pleasant. Now I find you to be pretty cool. I just chalk it up to us being really passionate and not as adept at explaining our passion in our youth. I still get like that, but I try to tone it down now, even if often it's to poor efect.
Very true very true.

It's weird to think about how many of us joined this site as angst risen teenagers (or in my case an angst ridden teenager in his 20's) and now we're married with adult jobs and possibly kids.

I'm very glad none of my students are as curious as I am. I mention joining a message board and debating theology as a big part of my spiritual development frequently in sermons. If I heard my pastor say that, I would totally cyber stalk him. Luckily none of my students are as big of creepers as I am. They don't need to see me grow up online.
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Unread 07-30-2014, 09:00 AM   #216
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Any song that touts 'Our God' being better than others. If I believe God is God then there isn't another god because only God is God. God is the ONE true God... I suppose if you count false gods then there are other gods but is a false god really a god? You know the answer!
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Unread 07-31-2014, 08:37 AM   #217
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Any song that touts 'Our God' being better than others. If I believe God is God then there isn't another god because only God is God. God is the ONE true God... I suppose if you count false gods then there are other gods but is a false god really a god? You know the answer!
Doesn't the Bible use the same language in many places though? Can't remember all the examples off the top of my head, but Psalm 97:9 immediately comes to mind - "For you, LORD, are the Most High over all the earth; you are exalted far above all gods."

1 Cor 8:5-6 explains this pretty well I think - "For even if there are so-called gods, whether in heaven or on earth (as indeed there are many "gods" and many "lords"), 6yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live."

So there is only one God, but there are many so-called "gods" and our God is far above any of those.
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Unread 07-31-2014, 10:39 AM   #218
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Yeah it does in several spots you see reference to 'other gods' . Its just one of those things that make you go hmmmm about ... when I read it in the Word I wonder if it is an inaccuracy in translation and perhaps when reference in that way isn't more of a representation of something that man might give worship which could be anything other than God that we placed before him.

One of these days when I have the time I would like to dig into the translation of those types of references and see for sure. Till then the reference to 'other gods' will just cause me to raise an eyebrow and reflect that there is only one God... our God.
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Unread 07-31-2014, 11:18 AM   #219
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Yeah it does in several spots you see reference to 'other gods' . Its just one of those things that make you go hmmmm about ... when I read it in the Word I wonder if it is an inaccuracy in translation and perhaps when reference in that way isn't more of a representation of something that man might give worship which could be anything other than God that we placed before him.

One of these days when I have the time I would like to dig into the translation of those types of references and see for sure. Till then the reference to 'other gods' will just cause me to raise an eyebrow and reflect that there is only one God... our God.
The concept that our God is greater than all other gods is pretty clear in Scripture and is expressed in those terms.

I would actually think that is pretty bold and accurate theological statement.
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Unread 07-31-2014, 11:39 AM   #220
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God is both a proper and common noun. In a similar way (grammatically/paradoxically speaking) to how we can say that a triune God can exist as one God in three persons, it is accurate to say both that there are many 'gods', as well as that there is only one 'God'.

On a somewhat similar note...anyone notice a trend toward modalism in some popular worship songs? I'm not one to split theological hairs, but someone smarter than me pointed it out once and now I can't help but notice. Is it just an oversight by songwriters, or just a theological trend?
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Unread 07-31-2014, 12:07 PM   #221
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God is both a proper and common noun. In a similar way (grammatically/paradoxically speaking) to how we can say that a triune God can exist as one God in three persons, it is accurate to say both that there are many 'gods', as well as that there is only one 'God'.
I agree. Our God is greater than any other god. Simple. Sweet. Accurate.
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Unread 01-28-2016, 10:57 PM   #222
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Sorry to resurrect this older thread, but I really enjoyed reading it, and wouldn't mind joining in...

Often times I find that I have more of an issue with songs that are simply suffering from poor and predictable writing than theological issues - although I find enough of those as well.

I remember a number of years ago one of our worship teams did a song that I think was called "Today" - "...Today I choose to follow you. Today I choose to give my yes to you..."

The following week at a staff meeting, one of the pastors (semi-retired, part-time) called that song flat-out heretical, that we don't choose God, he chooses us... While I personally didn't really care for the song, I didn't find it heretical. I tried to communicate what I thought the song was saying, which was not that we were choosing to follow of our own volition, but of course responding to the call of God, the great initiator, who first loved us. In order for us to give our "yes" there has to be an invitation given first for us to respond to, right?

Thoughts?
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Unread 01-28-2016, 11:25 PM   #223
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Southpaw Pete
Sorry to resurrect this older thread, but I really enjoyed reading it, and wouldn't mind joining in... Often times I find that I have more of an issue with songs that are simply suffering from poor and predictable writing than theological issues - although I find enough of those as well. I remember a number of years ago one of our worship teams did a song that I think was called "Today" - "...Today I choose to follow you. Today I choose to give my yes to you..." The following week at a staff meeting, one of the pastors (semi-retired, part-time) called that song flat-out heretical, that we don't choose God, he chooses us... While I personally didn't really care for the song, I didn't find it heretical. I tried to communicate what I thought the song was saying, which was not that we were choosing to follow of our own volition, but of course responding to the call of God, the great initiator, who first loved us. In order for us to give our "yes" there has to be an invitation given first for us to respond to, right? Thoughts?
I feel like the answer to this changes depending on whether or not you're in a Reformed church. Haha
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Unread 01-29-2016, 12:00 AM   #224
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I feel like the answer to this changes depending on whether or not you're in a Reformed church. Haha
Haha.

Yeah - I understand that there are some definite major points that the church should typically all agree on, but in my journeys I've found that sometimes what is considered "sound doctrine" or "heresy" can change from denomination to denomination... and interestingly enough, often times it seems that we are saying the same things, but any disagreements or theological judgements are based more on a misunderstanding of how something is worded more than anything else, if that makes sense.
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Unread 01-29-2016, 05:21 AM   #225
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