[BillSPrestonEsq]

Originally Posted by slap_j

If we accept your premise that mere existence requires time. I see no reason to accept that. I also see no reason to accept that God requires spatial dimensions. A spirit does not extend into space.

I tend to disagree and think spirits do have spatial existence if they hover over the face of the deep, or are sent out over the earth...

Spirits in scripture certainly seem to have spatial existence.

How does existence not require dimensions to exist in?

[slap_j]

Originally Posted by BillSPrestonEsq

I tend to disagree and think spirits do have spatial existence if they hover over the face of the deep, or are sent out over the earth...

Do you believe spirits to be immaterial? If so then there is nothing to extend into space. How they interact with the physical world is a mystery. If you do not believe spirits are immaterial then we're talking around each other.

How does existence not require dimensions to exist in?

Something that is non-physical doesn't require a physical dimension to exist in. Knowledge for instance.

[BillSPrestonEsq]

Originally Posted by slap_j

Do you believe spirits to be immaterial? If so then there is nothing to extend into space. How they interact with the physical world is a mystery. If you do not believe spirits are immaterial then we're talking around each other.

Yes, I do believe spirits have some sort of actual existence. Case in point is the segment in Daniel, speaking of Gabriel's delay getting to Daniel. (Quite a fascinating passage on the whole angelology, demonology which points to several older views on the spirit world that I find quite fascinating.

That, and the fact that spirits are sent out throughout the OT, and seem to have spatial existence throughout revelation.

Something that is non-physical doesn't require a physical dimension to exist in. Knowledge for instance.

Does knowledge exist. I mean raw, pure, knowledge.

I don't think so. Only things which have existence can posses knowledge. Without which it is merely an idea of a thing, rather than a thing which exists.

[jthomas1600]

It's interesting how certain people seem to from time to time have their journals hijacked for the purpose of theological debate. Anyway, I see no harm in being of the opinion that God exists with in the constraints of time. I find it odd though to say that he must exist with in the constraints of time...that if you believe other wise you believe in a fantastical figure... Isn't time a natural law? Not sure that's the right term, but what I'm getting it is God is not confined by space the way we are. There were several accounts of Jesus being here one instant and then miles away the next. If He's not bound by that limitation why does he have to be bound by time?

[slap_j]

Originally Posted by BillSPrestonEsq

Yes, I do believe spirits have some sort of actual existence.

So do I. I just don't believe God is composed of matter aside from the Incarnation.

Case in point is the segment in Daniel, speaking of Gabriel's delay getting to Daniel. That, and the fact that spirits are sent out throughout the OT, and seem to have spatial existence throughout revelation.

I don't think the historical perspective on angels is that they're infinite spirits like God is (they are created beings, after all). From the Catholic Encyclopedia:

...when we find the angels described as asomatoi or auloi, in the writings of the Fathers, this properly means only that the angels do not possess a gross, fleshly body; it does not at all imply a nature absolutely immaterial. Such Scripture expressions as "bread of angels", "they shall shine as the angels", as well as the apparitions of these heavenly beings, were adduced as proofs of their corporeality. So speak Sts. Ambrose, Chrysostom, Jerome, Hilary, Origen and many other Fathers.

Does knowledge exist. I mean raw, pure, knowledge.

I'm not sure what is meant by "raw, pure, knowledge."

Without which it is merely an idea of a thing, rather than a thing which exists.

Hm. Can't say I'm following you here. Ideas fall into the realm of knowledge.

Originally Posted by jthomas1600

It's interesting how certain people seem to from time to time have their journals hijacked for the purpose of theological debate.

Some people just have a special capacity to provoke good discussion.

[walkwjc]

In my miniscule understanding of Physics and Quantum Mechanics, time is not just time, but spacetime. In the natural world time is tied directly to the expansion of space and is described as a 'fabric' with waves and holes and valleys and mountains in a three dimensional framework. There are holes in this fabric that defy the laws of 'time' as we know it. In Quantum Mechanics there are thought to be 10 dimensions to the universe and all 10 were 'in existance' before the big bang happened. So, according to science even the big bang wasn't really the beginning of everything.

I believe in a God that could create that spacetime 'fabric'. When you stop looking at time as hours on a clock and in a more tangible way, I don't think God exists within that plane of being. Otherwise, he wouldn't be omniscient, right? If God exists within time, would he be bound by the same natural laws that we are?

So, in my mind, when you start looking for the begining of God, I get lost. Where do you start? I do believe that God is a fantastical being that I can't fully understand though. Don't feel free to call me a heretic. The problem I come up with is eternity. How do you explain eternity to a being that can't watch more than 30 minutes of television without being bored? Eternity has to be something outside of time, or outside of time as we know it, I'm guessing.

Another thing that crosses my mind is how time is relative to different things. To us time is perceived by how fast images are processed to our brain. When we are in flight or fight mode our brain speeds this process up and time seems to slow down. So what if our brain slowed down the image processing and time seemed to be in fast forward? Is eternity just one image processed? I mean, I know we will have glorified bodies and spirits and all, but that kinda stuff really gets my brain twisted.

[Demon_Hunter]

I admit, I know nothing of physics or quantum mechanics (though, I thought that according to string theorists that there were way more than just 10 dimensions, up in the 20's or something like that), so I wont even try to touch that post.

This week was so weird.

Tommorow is going to be fun. Im going to be recording a cover of Mighty To Save with my music minister. Im doing all the guitar parts for it. I doubt Ill be able to get a recording of it up here anytime soon, but when I can I will. It ought to be cool.

[walkwjc]

Originally Posted by Demon_Hunter

I admit, I know nothing of physics or quantum mechanics (though, I thought that according to string theorists that there were way more than just 10 dimensions, up in the 20's or something like that), so I wont even try to touch that post.

You are probably right. There are a few different theories out there and I am just an interested bystander in the realm of physics and quantum mechanics. It intrigues me though, and the more I read, the more I am convinced of my creator.

This week was so weird.

Good weird or bad weird?

Tommorow is going to be fun. Im going to be recording a cover of Mighty To Save with my music minister. Im doing all the guitar parts for it. I doubt Ill be able to get a recording of it up here anytime soon, but when I can I will. It ought to be cool.

That is a great song!

I didn't mean to kill the time discussion. Sorry.

[Demon_Hunter]

Originally Posted by walkwjc

You are probably right. There are a few different theories out there and I am just an interested bystander in the realm of physics and quantum mechanics. It intrigues me though, and the more I read, the more I am convinced of my creator.

Im the same way, the more I find out about the universe and how things work Im just amazed that anyone can believe there isnt a creator.

Good weird or bad weird?

A mix of both.

That is a great song!

I didn't mean to kill the time discussion. Sorry.

No worries. I was thinking on posting something else eventually, to get things going in a different direction.

I suppose I watch too much Stargate. For those who dont watch the show, one of the major premises of it is that humans can eventually evolve so far that they shed their physical bodies in exchange for existence as pure energy. And in this form you are pretty much all powerful and all knowing.
And watching stargate has made me wonder, just what is God? I mean, I know who God is from scripture, but what is God made of? What is the source of his power? Those questions have been pestering my brain lately.

[Demon_Hunter]

Monday night is one of the few nights I have that I can update my blog and have unfettered acess to the internet, primarilly because Im using the wifi connection at school to get on.

Had a wild day saturday. I was at church recording guitar parts for a cover of Mighty To Save. Then later that day I ran sound for a youth event at the same church. Busy busy day. I left home at 6:30am and didnt get back home until after 9:00pm.

Right now Im in class contemplating writing a bass part for Mighty To Save. I need to ask my Music Minister about it though.


I finished reading leviticus last night. Very interesting book. I think many people at my church would disagree with the conclusions I draw from reading that book.

[walkwjc]

Originally Posted by Demon_Hunter

I suppose I watch too much Stargate. For those who dont watch the show, one of the major premises of it is that humans can eventually evolve so far that they shed their physical bodies in exchange for existence as pure energy. And in this form you are pretty much all powerful and all knowing.
And watching stargate has made me wonder, just what is God? I mean, I know who God is from scripture, but what is God made of? What is the source of his power? Those questions have been pestering my brain lately.

Yeah, I wonder the same thing. I was reading an article on particles not too long ago and the science behind this certain particle suggested that it acted like both a particle and a wave depending on when it was observed. That kind of turns things on its head if a particle is not always a particle and a wave is not always a wave. I have wondered that if in reality everything is made of pure energy and there is no real matter. Would that give a different understanding to how God creates by speaking? That could possibly explain some of the supernatural things that happen in this world.

[BillSPrestonEsq]

My theological studies are leading me more and more into the place where I tend to think the ancients got it right for the most part. I tend to think of deity as a separate realm and that ancient Jewish angelology and demonology seems to be supported in scripture. However, being as Yahweh's name means existence, I think he actually has existence.

I think of existence of spirits as being exactly like that of physical, but with a different subset of characteristics. It seems as if angels are subject to time, and I can't conceive of how a being could be outside of time.

I am not to say this is not entirely impossible, but it seems that time is merely a description of a consequence of existence and action.

[Demon_Hunter]

Originally Posted by BillSPrestonEsq

My theological studies are leading me more and more into the place where I tend to think the ancients got it right for the most part. I tend to think of deity as a separate realm and that ancient Jewish angelology and demonology seems to be supported in scripture. [B]However, being as Yahweh's name means existence, I think he actually has existence.[/B

]I think of existence of spirits as being exactly like that of physical, but with a different subset of characteristics. It seems as if angels are subject to time, and I can't conceive of how a being could be outside of time.
I am not to say this is not entirely impossible, but it seems that time is merely a description of a consequence of existence and action.

Im leaning the same way. If God exists, then he isnt made of nothing. I hear preachers, and "mystics" (not sure what else to call them) try to explain the spiritual all the time and simply end with saying that we the physical cant understand the spiritual (or something to that effect, im paraphrasing generalities Ive heard expressed). But I think that the spiritual is simple an extension of the physical, or vise versa, we are merely an extension of the spiritual. If thats the case, then there is probably some way to study and examine the spiritual world that doesnt require out of body experiences, we just havnt discovered how yet (and probably wont).

Im sure Im not wording my ideas quite right, but I hope you get the point.


On a different, and unrelated topic, i got stood up tonight by one of my classmates.

We were supposed to meet so that we could practice some music I wrote, but I showed up at school and couldnt find him anywhere.

I wouldnt be nearly as peeved about it if it werent for the fact that Im borderline broke all the time and cant afford gas to make drives to school for no damn reason (I work clear on the other side of town from school, and live right in the middle, and it takes alot of gas/money to make that drive).

I guess im a bit of a fool for getting my hopes up that this dude would show.

Right now Im being a leach and taking advantage of the free WiFi i get in the school building. I dont feel bad about it since I paid $175 for a class that I dont really learn much in (not saying im learning nothing, im just not learning much).

Oh well.


Back to talking about God.

Me and my mom have had some interesting discussions about God, Aliens, and Creation.

Im of the opinion that there are other sentient, physical, beings out there that rival or suceede us in our mental and technological abilities. I dont think this is contrary to my christian beliefs. I believe in a very very creative God. And I cant reconcile the (dare i say it) artist revealed in scripture with the idea that God made us and just stopped. After the 7th day of creation he may have stopped creating, but we may not understand the full extent of what he created, and that may include other beings like ourselves.

[Demon_Hunter]

Another saturday, and (right on schedule) another headache.

Just grand.


Im recording bass today with my music minister. Despite my headache, im excited. Its going to be a pretty simple bass line, but itll be fun to play (bass is always fun to me for some reason).



*edit*

Headache is gone. Dont know why, but im happy. Im halfway through an episode of Stargate Universe, When thats over Im going to head to church and start rehearsing. My MM will get there at 10 and we'll rock it.

[Demon_Hunter]

I was asking my music minister about DAWs yesterday.

After a fairly lengthy discussion he introduced me to Reaper (though, I think Akaukal introduced me to it before). And he also introduced me to a crap load of amazing plug-ins.

Thats the route he is wanting to go. He now has his permanent residency visa, which is going to allow him to work outside of our church (for the last 4 or so years he has basically been trapped into working at one place because of his immigration status, and he refuses to work outside the law), and he is wanting to do recording and performing on his own. The program he is really excited about trying out is Reaper and building his DAW around that.

Im of the same mindset. Tommorow when Im in class Im going to download the trial version (which is actually the fully activated version that you pay for) which is free, and if I like it, then Ill pay the 60 dollar liscense fee.

If I like the results I get after a few months of use, then what Im planning on doing is buying another computer that is more powerful than the one I currently have (no way I can run all the stuff I want to run on my current laptop, its just not powerful enough), and start building up from Reaper.


Also, ive been searching for a Drum Sequencer for a while now, and my music minister got me turned on to something called EZDrummer and Superior 2.0 which are produced by toontracks. I listened to alot of samples yesterday. I never thought Id be impressed by sequenced drum sounds, but I was. It was awesome. EZDrummer is cheap, and its a good place to start out (and if I upgrade from that to Superior 2.0 then I get a discount on Superior).

So... Im excited.

When I start getting results from these 2 programs Ill begin posting them.