[Nate]

Originally Posted by Skeeter

Really? Derek Webb is everything that is wrong in the church?

Yes. The thought that the single greatest enemy of the church is the state is pretty much the worst thing going for modern Christianity.

The best thing that can be done to improve the relationship between Christianity and politics is to ignore it. It's just not important.

Jesus told us to render to Caesar.

Secondly, I don't see anything wrong with that e-mail: I think you're seeing things that just aren't there.

I don't know. He's tried tons of promotional gimmicks before ("free" album releases in return for word-of-mouth advertising, for one example).

I don't find it hard to believe at all that this is a carefully constructed marketing device and the album will, in fact, be released on his label soon.

Maybe I'm just getting too cynical.

This was an e-mail that was sent out to his mailing list, correct? People who would be interested to know about his new album, especially if it was going to be delayed? Typing in lowercase is fake humility? ****, better not let everyone who sends text messages know that or they're going to feel sooooo stupid...

I capitalize and [mostly] use proper punctuation in my text messages. Then again, I see language as almost the holiest among all human endeavors.

His whole brand image is "Oh, I'm so humble; I'm just a martyr; I'm just one voice," etc. It's built on plain white tees and self-effacing language. It's defeatist.

It's like Mark Driscoll without balls.

That's worse than Driscoll with balls.

Personally, I appreciate Derek Webb and his music a great deal. I don't see any attempt to tear down; instead I see an attempt to re-focus.

It's a lousy focus, I think. I really do.

It's the social gospel of years past.

[Nate]

And, yes, I'm pretty much being an ass.

What was that saying: "an ass for an ass"?

Well, close enough. If he can be one, so can I.

[Sean]

I'm not really a fan of Webb. So nothing I say is coming from a personal bias or feeling of ownership towards him.

Originally Posted by Nate

It just reeks of viral marketing and appeal to people's story-seeking.

Or he's just writing an email to his fans to explain to them why a new album isn't being released. An email to your mailing list seems like an appropriate place to tell this kind of story. If he posted a series of blogs, YouTube videos, and Relevant magazine interviews detailing his battle with his label I'd be more inclined to agree with you.

But an email to his mailing list? It seems like a big jump to assume he's attempting to start a viral campaign. Of course, he has always been a bit too self-referentially controversial.

I'm just tired of him in general. His shtick of white t-shirts reeks, too.

Would you prefer he hired a stylist? If he wears his t-shirts it's a shtick. If he suddenly changes cloths then he's selling out or alienating his core fans. It seems like no matter what he does someone is going to accuse him of something.

I think he's everything that is wrong in the church.

Unless you mean something different from what you're communicating here, I really hope you're exaggerating.

[Nate]

Originally Posted by Sean

Of course, he has always been a bit too self-referentially controversial.

Exactly. It's just silly.

Unless you mean something different from what you're communicating here, I really hope you're exaggerating.

Well, see my blog title.

Perhaps I should say, more accurately, that his ideas are everything that is wrong with the modern church as such, as distinguished from things such as apathy, coldheartedness, sin, corruption, etc that have been wrong with the church for millennia.

If I could pick one thing that keeps the church from fulfilling its purpose today, it would be its attempt to fulfill its purpose by setting itself up either against or for the state (for all Webb's railing against politics, he sure has a lot to say that is political... ironic?).

[Nate]

Originally Posted by Sean

Or he's just writing an email to his fans to explain to them why a new album isn't being released. An email to your mailing list seems like an appropriate place to tell this kind of story. If he posted a series of blogs, YouTube videos, and Relevant magazine interviews detailing his battle with his label I'd be more inclined to agree with you.

But an email to his mailing list? It seems like a big jump to assume he's attempting to start a viral campaign.

But what's happened?

Already on this forum alone, two completely independent references to the email, and subsequent discussions, were started.

I bet if you google it, similar threads have started on other Christian music forums wondering what exactly the email was all about.

Looks like a virus to me.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Nate

Well, see my blog title.

Perhaps I should say, more accurately, that his ideas are everything that is wrong with the modern church as such, as distinguished from things such as apathy, coldheartedness, sin, corruption, etc that have been wrong with the church for millennia.

If I could pick one thing that keeps the church from fulfilling its purpose today, it would be its attempt to fulfill its purpose by setting itself up either against or for the state (for all Webb's railing against politics, he sure has a lot to say that is political... ironic?).

That makes sense.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Nate

But what's happened?

Already on this forum alone, two completely independent references to the email, and subsequent discussions, were started.

I bet if you google it, similar threads have started on other Christian music forums wondering what exactly the email was all about.

Looks like a virus to me.

True but I can also see it from the other side. He's sitting around trying to figure out how to release his album, and he remembers he hasn't updated his fans on what is happening. So he writes an email to inform them that their is a hold up over the content of one of the songs.

As someone without many biases regarding him, that seems likely an equally likely scenario.

[Skeeter]

I guess I never really saw him as anti-state. I always saw it as a criticism of the church being too closely linked with the state, which is a legitimate criticism in my mind.

[Nate]

We went and looked at three houses on the Northshore this weekend. That was an adventure.

I'm not sure any of those will work out for us, but we have four more scheduled for tomorrow.

We'd like to get out of the suburbs and out of the city, into somewhere quieter and safer .

Added bonus (or not?) : The main location we're looking at has a huge knitting store for Cat.

Fortunately, we don't have two cars yet, so while I'm at work, she'd have to walk if she wanted to go.

[BillSPrestonEsq]

Originally Posted by Nate

We went and looked at three houses on the Northshore this weekend. That was an adventure.

I'm not sure any of those will work out for us, but we have four more scheduled for tomorrow.

We'd like to get out of the suburbs and out of the city, into somewhere quieter and safer .

Added bonus (or not?) : The main location we're looking at has a huge knitting store for Cat.

Fortunately, we don't have two cars yet, so while I'm at work, she'd have to walk if she wanted to go.

That sounds awesome Nate. I hear you on getting out of the city and suburbs into a quiet place. Thats my long term dream.

[Nate]

Originally Posted by Billgamesh

That sounds awesome Nate. I hear you on getting out of the city and suburbs into a quiet place. Thats my long term dream.

The place we're looking at is really quiet, almost rural, but only 10 minutes from two major-ish suburbs of N.O., and only 30-40 minutes from where we live now (the biggest N.O. suburb). We'd be within biking distance of a couple good suburban malls, and within easy driving distance of pretty much everything we like about where we're living now. My commute would be a little under an hour (right now, it's already 35 minutes on a good day).

There are wooded (and paved!) devoted bike paths throughout the area, quite a few very nice looking restaurants, a lot of well-established neighborhoods, an average lot size of probably at least a third of an acre, and kids and families walking / biking / driving around everywhere. There's not a Wal-Mart in sight (hopefully never!), nor an apartment complex or high-rise for miles! A few areas have some seedy looking trailers, but no real "trailer parks".

[BillSPrestonEsq]

Originally Posted by Nate

The place we're looking at is really quiet, almost rural, but only 10 minutes from two major-ish suburbs of N.O., and only 30-40 minutes from where we live now (the biggest N.O. suburb). We'd be within biking distance of a couple good suburban malls, and within easy driving distance of pretty much everything we like about where we're living now. My commute would be a little under an hour (right now, it's already 35 minutes on a good day).

There are wooded (and paved!) devoted bike paths throughout the area, quite a few very nice looking restaurants, a lot of well-established neighborhoods, an average lot size of probably at least a third of an acre, and kids and families walking / biking / driving around everywhere. There's not a Wal-Mart in sight (hopefully never!), nor an apartment complex or high-rise for miles! A few areas have some seedy looking trailers, but no real "trailer parks".

Sounds awesome. I am jealous in a good sort of way...

[Nate]

So, that songwriting site I had to sign up for to enter the Pierce Pettis contest (still awaiting the results on June 1st!) has other contests. I got an email this morning with the winning submission to the May/June Lyric-Writing Contest:

Insert the knife of life
Into the last breath of death
Let it bleed what you need
And as it soaks into your chest
Tear apart your heart
And unbreak every ache
Twist your dreams until they scream
Wring out every mistake
Then Love, Baby Love
Like There's No Tomorrow

From "Like There's No Tomorrow"
Words written by Max McGee

Really?

C'mon.

Hasn't every poor emo kid written that song in their parents' basement at one time or another?

"Insert the knife of life into the last breath of death" has to be the clumsiest lyric I've ever seen.

It's like he listened to "Bleeding Love" and decided he'd try his hand at the same exact metaphor.

Only problem is "Bleeding Love" is a brilliant song, and this "Like There's No Tomorrow" just isn't.

I especially like how he did the chintzy internal rhymes in each line so he could squeeze in every last cliche emo rhyme in the book. Nice. He probably thought it was clever, too.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Also in the email inbox this morning is another email from Derek Webb (or whomever is sending emails on his behalf):

friends-
this is turning into a bigger deal than we expected. as a result, we're having to temporarily _pull everything online down (can't explain now). and to be on the s_afe side, i'm going to pe_rsonally go offline while we sort this out. i re_ally shouldn't use my twitter account for now either so _don't expect any updates there.

make no m_istake, our trouble with the label over content i_s very real, and not as simple as one word; we're back_ed into a corner. but we have applied all of our creative resources to th_is, working furiou_sly to create something that we believe not only subverts any leg_al issues but should also be a _pretty wild ride.

so this will be the l_ast email for a while. we'll t_ry to lea_k information via a new tw_itter account, @ssyndrome. you're o_n your own so start payin_g attention. i'l_l see you _on the o_ther side-
derek

What on earth?

Maybe that convinces some of you, but not me. Still reeks of viral marketing to the fullest.

Especially considering that he's talking about "Trying to leak information," like he's attempting to hide it from his record label by being all covert, but then this email is posted right smack on the front page of his now "taken down" website, which is almost certainly controlled and owned by the record label, not by him personally.

And what's with those underscores?

[Sean]

That one seemed a lot more shady to me. Apperently being a "controversial" artist is a lot like being a spy. Sometimes you have to go dark and can only communicate in code through secret channels.

[Nate]

Originally Posted by Sean

That one seemed a lot more shady to me. Apperently being a "controversial" artist is a lot like being a spy. Sometimes you have to go dark and can only communicate in code through secret channels.

More than anything, I think what sets it off as amateur viral marketing rather than as an honest attempt to let fans know what's going on is the vagueness of it all.

I've found that, in almost any sphere of life, if a person only speaks in vagueries ("our trouble with the label over content is very real, and not as simple as one word") and doesn't (or refuses, in this case) to explain anything substantial, that they don't really have anything to say at all.

Politicians do it: "We need better healthcare, we need more jobs, and we need a secure and strong nation!" "AMEN ! YES WE DO ! YES WE CAN ! HEIL HEIL HEIL !"

Seems to be if he really wanted to let us in on the "controversy," that he'd explain it a bit more ("Guys, there's a song on this new album that touches on issue of sexual abuse in Christian marriages, and the record label thinks that it's too sensitive of a topic" or something like that).

As it is now, it just smells like, as I said earlier, an appeal to our story-seeking nature ("EXTRA EXTRA! READ ALL ABOUT IT!" ... nevermind what "it" is... who really cares?).

I guess I should go back to the political argument and say that I actually applaud Obama for at least making some positive, quantifiable claims ("We need to get gas guzzlers down to 35 mpg by 2012" or whatever his plan is). These are actual, substantial, verifiable, and debateable.

You can't debate what isn't there. Right now, Derek is "all sound and fury signifying nothing", if I may quote that oft-overused phrase. He's just not saying anything at all.