Attn: All Catholics who care.... And all who care, not just Catholics...

goldenchild · 04-10-2004, 12:11 AM

I've never posted here, so I don't know where to put this, but....
Here are some guidelines that all Catholics should follow in there decision for a vote...
"A well-formed Christian conscience does not permit one to vote for a political program or an individual law that contradicts the fundamental contents of faith and morals" (CPL 4)

Here are the 5 things Catholics, and all people really, must take into consideration when voting. These are the most important. They overshadow all other problems a candidate may have... Here they are.

THE FIVE NON-NEGOTIABLE ISSUES

1. Abortion
The Church teaches that, regarding a law permitting abortions, it is "never licit to obey it, or to take part in a propaganda campaign in favor of such a law, or to vote for it" (EV 73). Abortion is the intentional and direct killing of an innocent human being, and therefore it is a form of homicide.

2. Euthanasia
Often disguised by the name "mercy killing," euthanasia also is a form of homicide. No one has a right to take his own life (suicide), and no one has the right to take the life of any innocent person.

In euthanasia, the ill or elderly are killed out of a misplaced sense of compassion, but true compassion cannot include doing something intrinsically evil to another person (cf. EV 73).

3. Fetal Stem Cell Research
Human embryos are human beings. "Respect for the dignity of the human being excludes all experimental manipulation or exploitation of the human embryo" (CRF 4b).

Recent scientific advances show that any medical cure that might arise from experimentation on fetal stem cells can be developed by using adult stem cells instead. Adult stem cells can be obtained without doing harm to the adults from whom they come. Thus there no longer is a medical argument in favor of using fetal stem cells.

4. Human Cloning

"Attempts . . . for obtaining a human being without any connection with sexuality through 'twin fission,' cloning, or parthenogenesis are to be considered contrary to the moral law, since they are in opposition to the dignity both of human procreation and of the conjugal union" (RHL I:6).

Human cloning also ends up being a form of homicide because the "rejected" or "unsuccessful" clones are destroyed, yet each clone is a human being.

5. Homosexual "Marriage"

True marriage is the union of one man and one woman. Legal recognition of any other form of "marriage" undermines true marriage, and legal recognition of homosexual unions actually does homosexual persons a disfavor by encouraging them to persist in what is an objectively immoral arrangement.

"When legislation in favor of the recognition of homosexual unions is proposed for the first time in a legislative assembly, the Catholic lawmaker has a moral duty to express his opposition clearly and publicly and to vote against it. To vote in favor of a law so harmful to the common good is gravely immoral" (UHP 10).

It makes no difference what party one normally votes with. If there is a candidate who BEST supports ALL of these issues, then a good Catholic and Christian is morally obligated to vote for that person.

Bush holds a Catholic view on all 5 Non-Negotiable issues.

Kerry holds anti-Catholic views on all 5 Non-Negotiable issues.

Kerry claims to be Catholic, but obviously is not.

This is a start...

Travis · 04-10-2004, 01:22 PM

I am glad not all Roman Catholics are being taken in by the (alleged) fact that Kerry is a Roman Catholic. Some guy on the news was talking about him getting the loyal Roman Catholic vote and I was thinking, what the heck? It seems as though all loyal Roman Catholics wouldn't vote for him due to his stance on those issues.

goldenchild · 04-11-2004, 01:25 AM

Yeah, and if ya think about it, it actually is kind of a nice way to get votes... If you say your RC, then you can have a chance of getting the votes of of RC's who don't really pay much attention to the issues... And you can still get the votes of many others, who would support those things... Scary situation, smart idea, but no Christian should fall for what's he trying to pull...

suntuoso · 05-05-2004, 07:54 AM

Well, You know I am not a R.C. But I have to say I agree with those points made. And really in my opinion That should be the out look on those issues by any one of the christian faith. Really I would think any one with a little common sense should see it that way. It sucks that I am not 18 yet. I want to vote so bad. We just need to keep in prayer that we don't vote Kerry into offfice.

JakeW · 05-05-2004, 08:02 AM

Speaking of Kerry being a terrible R.C. did anyone catch the announcement this weekend that Kerry should be denied communion if he goes to church?

Talk about a clear cut message to ole Kerry-boy that hi stances aren't aligned with his religion. Ouch.

Does anyone know more specifics than I do? I'd be curious to see who said it and who they were talking to.

Jake

JerryLove · 05-05-2004, 08:10 AM

Quote:

Here are the 5 things Catholics, and all people really, must take into consideration when voting. These are the most important. They overshadow all other problems a candidate may have...

So you would, for example, support a president that thought all non-democracies should be nuked, all white people should be deported to antartica, and homosexuality should be compulsirary over these?

Quote:

Kerry claims to be Catholic, but obviously is not.

The American Catholic church has diverged heavily from the Roman Catholic church. They even allow the sin of condoms.

Quote:

Yeah, and if ya think about it, it actually is kind of a nice way to get votes... If you say your RC, then you can have a chance of getting the votes of of RC's who don't really pay much attention to the issues

It was the 1960s before a Roman Catholic managed to get elected to the presidency; it's not a majority religion here. He would do far better ot be Prodistant.

Quote:

Really I would think any one with a little common sense should see it that way.

I have a dissenting opinion there. I suppose you assert that I lack common sense.

Quote:

Speaking of Kerry being a terrible R.C. did anyone catch the announcement this weekend that Kerry should be denied communion if he goes to church?

That would be up to the church heiarchy under Catholic docterine.

**Ted Logan** · 05-05-2004, 08:44 AM

An edict was declared by a cardinal at the Vatican, stating that Kerry should not receive nor be given Communion. The fact that the Archdiocese of Boston has refused this declaration, saying that "We don't think we should deny anyone Communion" is a travesty, in my humble opinion. Goldenchild, is that even proper, for an Archdiocese to do the opposite of what is mandated by the Vatican?

**+Donny** · 05-05-2004, 08:45 AM

Quote:

So you would, for example, support a president that thought all non-democracies should be nuked, all white people should be deported to antartica, and homosexuality should be compulsirary over these?

Jerry, that was a completely illogical deduction from her intention and words. She said these were the most important, not that the other issues didn't matter.

**+Donny** · 05-05-2004, 08:49 AM

Aaron-I am beginning to realize that the only way we can effectively critique and examine RCC teachings is by looking at their official declarations, catechisms, etc. It seems that quite a few common myths about RCC teaching and practice are actually directly against official teachings and probably come from things that are similar to what you just mentioned. I have a feeling Protestants will start thinking that the RCC is liberal because an archdiocese in Boston said everyone should get communion (which is absolutely ridiculous).

JerryLove · 05-05-2004, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Jerry, that was a completely illogical deduction from her intention and words. She said these were the most important, not that the other issues didn't matter.

I did not claim otherwise.

President A: opposes cloning but supports nuking Canada.
President B: opposes nuking Canada but supports cloning.

Cloning is on the "most important" list, and nuking Canada is not. Therefore you should vote for "A" as he has the correct stance on the more important issue.

Quote:

Goldenchild, is that even proper, for an Archdiocese to do the opposite of what is mandated by the Vatican?

According to vatican docterine, I believe the answer is "no".

**+Donny** · 05-05-2004, 09:09 AM

Quote:

I did not claim otherwise.

President A: opposes cloning but supports nuking Canada.
President B: opposes nuking Canada but supports cloning.

Cloning is on the "most important" list, and nuking Canada is not. Therefore you should vote for "A" as he has the correct stance on the more important issue.

Nuking Canada is murder, which is opposed for the same reason abortion is above. It would be just as important as the others, but such is assumed when reading her post. We have to respect her intentions.
Furthermore, nuking Canada is not a present issue, so it's irrelevant.

Travis · 05-05-2004, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JerryLove

I did not claim otherwise.

President A: opposes cloning but supports nuking Canada.
President B: opposes nuking Canada but supports cloning.

Cloning is on the "most important" list, and nuking Canada is not. Therefore you should vote for "A" as he has the correct stance on the more important issue.

You act as though one only has two choices--A and B. One could merely vote for another candidate or refuse to vote at all.

JerryLove · 05-05-2004, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Nuking Canada is murder, which is opposed for the same reason abortion is above. It would be just as important as the others, but such is assumed when reading her post. We have to respect her intentions.

I don't agree. When someone is preaching on-high about what others should and should not do, I will take it at face value. You may interprete it is you wish.

Quote:

You act as though one only has two choices--A and B. One could merely vote for another candidate or refuse to vote at all.

Not voting is tantamount to voting for the person who currently has the most support. But, if you want to voluentarily give up the only real power you have... go for it.

goldenchild · 05-05-2004, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by suntuoso

Well, You know I am not a R.C. But I have to say I agree with those points made. And really in my opinion That should be the out look on those issues by any one of the christian faith. Really I would think any one with a little common sense should see it that way. It sucks that I am not 18 yet. I want to vote so bad. We just need to keep in prayer that we don't vote Kerry into offfice.

Yeah, I'll be eligible to vote for the first time this year, so I'll do my part.

goldenchild · 05-05-2004, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aaron Adams

An edict was declared by a cardinal at the Vatican, stating that Kerry should not receive nor be given Communion. The fact that the Archdiocese of Boston has refused this declaration, saying that "We don't think we should deny anyone Communion" is a travesty, in my humble opinion. Goldenchild, is that even proper, for an Archdiocese to do the opposite of what is mandated by the Vatican?

Ya know, I'm not positive on that one... I'll look it up. I'd say that no, it should not happen. But I'll check...