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Unread 01-31-2004, 10:58 PM   #1
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Hard-core vocal strengthening technique, would this work?

I heard from a drama teacher once that screaming until hoarse, then chugging salt water will help strengthen vocal chords. Sounds like an old wives tale, but I'd do it if I knew it worked.

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Unread 02-01-2004, 06:50 AM   #2
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Umm.. no! lol! The only thing that yelling until hoarse will do is MAJOR damage to your vocal chords! Chugging salt water afterwards? I fail to see how that could would help...? I mean if you have an infection in your throat then gargling salt water will help get rid of it... I don't reccomend trying it to see if it works either.. lol!
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Unread 02-01-2004, 09:15 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by rhonda_schofiel
Umm.. no! lol! The only thing that yelling until hoarse will do is MAJOR damage to your vocal chords! Chugging salt water afterwards? I fail to see how that could would help...? I mean if you have an infection in your throat then gargling salt water will help get rid of it... I don't reccomend trying it to see if it works either.. lol!
That was my instinct
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Originally Posted by Brent
That's why Jesus would use a 5-10 watt tube combo. Then Jesus can get that nice breakup He likes at a manageable volume. A volume that is somewhat formal but still says I'm here to party. Much like tuxedo t-shirt Jesus.
"If all experienced God in the same way and returned Him an identical worship, the song of the Church triumphant would have no symphony, it would be like an orchestra in which all the instruments played the same note." - C.S. Lewis
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Unread 02-01-2004, 11:15 AM   #4
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"Chugging" salt water would make you sick if it were salty enough!!!!! So then you would be screaming your head off and puking your guts up (not to mention the effect it would have on your kidneys from trying to handle drinking salt water!)!

Maybe they meant "gargling"? If you gargle with salt water, it can reduce inflammation in your throat and take some of the swelling out (obviously how often you gargle would affect how much it would help). But why put all that stress on your vocal chords and then try to alleviate the damage by gargling???? I agree with Rhonda!
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Unread 02-01-2004, 12:51 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crteach
"Chugging" salt water would make you sick if it were salty enough!!!!! So then you would be screaming your head off and puking your guts up (not to mention the effect it would have on your kidneys from trying to handle drinking salt water!)!

Maybe they meant "gargling"? If you gargle with salt water, it can reduce inflammation in your throat and take some of the swelling out (obviously how often you gargle would affect how much it would help). But why put all that stress on your vocal chords and then try to alleviate the damage by gargling???? I agree with Rhonda!
lol! Never thought about getting sick from "chugging" the salt water.. Good point! I just think the idea sounds kind of silly.. lol! I wonder where the idea originated from...
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Unread 02-03-2004, 04:56 PM   #6
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That's pretty funny about chugging salt water. Ya gotta wonder where they came up with that!

The only thing that strengthens your voice is using it. Of course there's not a good way to sing hardcore. The good rock singers have strengthened their voices by singing with a lot of power and are conditioned so they can get away with some screaming. You can't start with the screaming - it will leave you without any voice. But when your singing voice is strong you can scream a little and still be able to sing.

Singing with strength is the same physically as shouting. If your car was across the street and you saw somebody breaking into it, you'd plant your feet firmly, lean forward a little, hold your head erect facing forward, breathe in from the diaphragm, and use your diaphragm to push a lot of air through your larynx as you shout "Hey!" with your throat and mouth open wide, and the tissues of your throat tensed.

Sing hard and sing often and you will develop the conditioning that will allow you to get away with some screaming - with time. I really don't think there are any salt water short-cuts!
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Unread 02-03-2004, 09:58 PM   #7
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I don't see how some of these screamers do it!!!! I mean, it hurts my voice just to listen to some of those kinds of songs!!!!
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Unread 02-03-2004, 10:49 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crteach
I don't see how some of these screamers do it!!!! I mean, it hurts my voice just to listen to some of those kinds of songs!!!!
I can scream a bit. I remember Kurt Cobain saying in an interview he used to just walk around screaming when he was a kid, and that's how he got his voice like that.
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That's why Jesus would use a 5-10 watt tube combo. Then Jesus can get that nice breakup He likes at a manageable volume. A volume that is somewhat formal but still says I'm here to party. Much like tuxedo t-shirt Jesus.
"If all experienced God in the same way and returned Him an identical worship, the song of the Church triumphant would have no symphony, it would be like an orchestra in which all the instruments played the same note." - C.S. Lewis
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Unread 02-04-2004, 03:14 PM   #9
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that drama teacher should be shot... what an idiot...

yeah, sure, using your voice makes it stronger or...try "you just think it does because you can't feel pain" but the more you scream, or even sing too much, you're damaging your vocal chords.. Cobain sang like that because he had scar tissue from all that singing...(same w/ axel rose)
Eventually it's gonna catch up w/ you..(ah em..."nodes")
and as for the SALT WATER! if he/she really meant "chugging" well..I don't know what to say to that..except they've been doing a little too much chugging (if you know what I mean..)<a href='http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb008' target='_blank'><img src='http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/10/10_7_5.gif' border=0></a>
but it he/she meant gargling?...still not the greatest...it's good if you HAVE to sing...a good "quick fix"..butdon't try it all the time....any palliative measure (such as chloraseptic) will just make you screw up your voice that much more because you can't feel the damage you're doing...

If you're gonna scream..or even sing alot...REST your voice..at least 24 hours...(it takes 72 for complete cellular repair)
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Unread 02-04-2004, 10:03 PM   #10
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I'd only do that if i wanted to sound like Bob Dylan. forever.
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Unread 02-05-2004, 07:10 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by georgeo
I'd only do that if i wanted to sound like Bob Dylan. forever.
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Unread 02-05-2004, 02:44 PM   #12
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No, that's definitely not a good idea.

Also, remember the volume level of most screamers isn't huge. It sounds huge because of vocal distortion, or overdrive, as well as the volumes being made higher for screamed sections.
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Unread 02-14-2004, 11:59 AM   #13
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A lot of people have made a career of screaming when they sing. When you sing rock you learn about conditioning. You don't need to let your vocal folds rest and recover completely between the times you sing. They respond like muscles in an exercise program - they won't get stronger unless they are stressed. You need to find the balance between healthy stress and damage. When you run the pounding is bad for your knees, but if you don't condition your knees to take a pounding you'll never be able to run.

A choir singer may be able to get away with never strenghtening their voice with use, but any performer singing solo, and especially singing rock, needs to build up strength and endurance in their voice. Screaming is going to do some damage, but it may be damage you are willing to take and it might make you sound like you want to sound.

My advice is to build up vocal strength through use, scream only when you need to and limit the amount of damage. Dale Thompson would say scream your head off!
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Unread 02-24-2004, 11:22 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thud
A lot of people have made a career of screaming when they sing. When you sing rock you learn about conditioning. You don't need to let your vocal folds rest and recover completely between the times you sing. They respond like muscles in an exercise program - they won't get stronger unless they are stressed. You need to find the balance between healthy stress and damage. When you run the pounding is bad for your knees, but if you don't condition your knees to take a pounding you'll never be able to run.

A choir singer may be able to get away with never strenghtening their voice with use, but any performer singing solo, and especially singing rock, needs to build up strength and endurance in their voice. Screaming is going to do some damage, but it may be damage you are willing to take and it might make you sound like you want to sound.

My advice is to build up vocal strength through use, scream only when you need to and limit the amount of damage. Dale Thompson would say scream your head off!
Not to be rude, but this is very dangerous advice. Damage is NEVER good...nodules gotten from incorrect singing (even soft singing!!!) can cause permanant damage. Choir singers in good academic choirs know a lot more about vocal health than *any* rock singer who screams.

When you "stress" your vocal chords to "make them stronger"...you don't do it in an unhealthy way. Thats like saying...its okay to lift heavy objects with your back till you just hurt it a little bit, because you build endurance. Or to say its okay to tear your cartilage in your knees a little because it makes them stronger! NO NO NO!!! Healthy singing will not hurt...it will feel good.

Your voice is very delicate...and its the only one you have. Don't abuse it, please!
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Unread 02-26-2004, 08:33 PM   #15
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I donít think you are rude at all, Amy, and I hope you wonít think I am either. But Iíve never seen or experienced all this danger you speak of. I know people whoíve done permanent damage to knees, backs, and shoulders, but I donít know of anybody whoís done permanent damage to their voice, or had to have surgery. The only person Iíve ever heard of who canít sing anymore is David Lee Roth. Does anybody here really know someone who sang so hard they canít sing at all any more? That has to be extremely rare.

Iíve only heard this damage-to-your-voice paranoia in choir settings, which is puzzling to me because I never even got a decent vocal workout in the choirs Iíve been in. In pop/rock settings the discussion is always about techniques that allow you to sing long gigs several times a week. The most popular singers are not gentle with their voices, but they find ways to keep doing what they do for many years. Steven Curtis Chapman can growl and scream with the best, but he has the conditioning and technique to get away with it and still sound pretty on the softer songs. Mac Powell, Mark Stuart, and Steve Wiggins have been growling out tunes for a long time. They can still carry a tune and people love their voices. You can bet they never saw a decent vocal coach until after they were successful.

I donít think the voice is fragile Ė itís a lot tougher than knees and shoulders! It doesnít have cartilage, itís just muscle and skin rubbing together. Iíve read that surgical intervention is called for when lesions on the vocal folds wonít heal, but I donít know anybody whoís had to have that done. Iíve blown my voice out pretty badly twice (once was singing) but it was fully recovered in a couple of months. The best therapy was singing (not screaming). Everybody who sings pushes their voice too hard sometimes and you canít even understand the concepts of good coaching without quite a bit of singing experience, yet everybody I know has survived this abuse.

I never want to sound like Mark Stuart myself, but gritty-voiced rock singers are always in demand. You really can do this without something bad and permanent happening.
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