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Unread 02-26-2004, 10:42 PM   #16
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Ummmm....
you definately can hurt your voice long term.

Just ask any middle school choral teacher, and most high school level ones. They've done so much singing, very few have the voice they once had.
My teacher has gone from an incredible baritone to barely anything, becuase he overused his voice.

i have a friend majoring in vocal performance who is incredible, but she sang wrong in middle school, and still has residual damage from that.

My teacher may be getting surgury over the summer to lessen the damage.

Seriously folk, vocal damage happens. You never hear about it with these screaming bands singers losing their voice because the bands don't stay in existance long enough. By the time the damage has run its course, the singers are washouts no one remembers.

Vocal damage happens folks. Even losing your voice at a basketball game cheering on your team is devastating to your voice. Doing it once isn't going to kill your voice, but repeatedly, its really bad.

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Unread 02-29-2004, 02:34 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thud
I donít think you are rude at all, Amy, and I hope you wonít think I am either. But Iíve never seen or experienced all this danger you speak of. I know people whoíve done permanent damage to knees, backs, and shoulders, but I donít know of anybody whoís done permanent damage to their voice, or had to have surgery. The only person Iíve ever heard of who canít sing anymore is David Lee Roth. Does anybody here really know someone who sang so hard they canít sing at all any more? That has to be extremely rare.

Iíve only heard this damage-to-your-voice paranoia in choir settings, which is puzzling to me because I never even got a decent vocal workout in the choirs Iíve been in. In pop/rock settings the discussion is always about techniques that allow you to sing long gigs several times a week. The most popular singers are not gentle with their voices, but they find ways to keep doing what they do for many years. Steven Curtis Chapman can growl and scream with the best, but he has the conditioning and technique to get away with it and still sound pretty on the softer songs. Mac Powell, Mark Stuart, and Steve Wiggins have been growling out tunes for a long time. They can still carry a tune and people love their voices. You can bet they never saw a decent vocal coach until after they were successful.

I donít think the voice is fragile Ė itís a lot tougher than knees and shoulders! It doesnít have cartilage, itís just muscle and skin rubbing together. Iíve read that surgical intervention is called for when lesions on the vocal folds wonít heal, but I donít know anybody whoís had to have that done. Iíve blown my voice out pretty badly twice (once was singing) but it was fully recovered in a couple of months. The best therapy was singing (not screaming). Everybody who sings pushes their voice too hard sometimes and you canít even understand the concepts of good coaching without quite a bit of singing experience, yet everybody I know has survived this abuse.

I never want to sound like Mark Stuart myself, but gritty-voiced rock singers are always in demand. You really can do this without something bad and permanent happening.
Julie Andrews (Maria, The Sound of Music, Mary Poppins, Broadway: My Fair Lady, Camelot, etc...) can no longer perform because she has lost her top range from doing too much Victor/Victoria ...where she played a man and woman part, thus singing outside her range. This is very very sad...I'm sure she is devestated about not taking care of her voice.

I have 3 friends right now who have nodules or have had, or are recovering from them. When your vocal chords are abused, they toughen up and get hard, fixed nodules on them. This keeps the chords from closing all the way and you have a limited range and get tired quickly. This is BAD!!! If its not attended to (going to a specialist, going on vocal rest ...NO TALKING or sometimes just no singing)...it can cause permanant damage. I've seen pictures of these lesions and nodules...and its NOT pretty!

People who were cheerleaders and have damaged their voices sometimes are very breathy when they sing, and have lost a possible range they once had. Of course, some people are not singers and cannot sing and never would have learned how to anyway...so it really doesn't matter if they damage thier voices. People like this who sing in bands or "scream" in bands...I guess it really doesn't matter to us or them if their voices are healthy or not. So I guess let them scream all they want.

But for those of us who are legitimate singers, please regaurd your voice as delicate.
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Unread 03-31-2004, 10:46 AM   #18
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I have to agree with you guys. Vocal damage, if bad enough, is irreversible. Straining your voice in anyway will royally screw it up.
One way to strengthen your voice it to use it, as someone said. An effective way to do this is to do about 4 vocal exercises everyday and once you really get those techniques down, move on to more challenging exercises.
Trust me, it really works.
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Unread 03-24-2005, 11:58 AM   #19
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Vocal Damage - Healing

I am a relatively new vocalist on my church praise and worship team. My passion for this ministry continues to grow. After rehearsing and performing an Easter production this week (as a shouting "townsperson" character), I have pretty much lost my voice (I can get some noise out, but it is very hoarse). I have 4 more days of performances and I'm curious to know what this might do to my vocal chords. The Worship Ministry is very important to me, but so is helping to save souls. This production is very powerful and many souls were saved after last night's performance. P.T.L.

It sounds like there may be some vocal (or perhaps Ear, Nose, Throat)professionals on this forum. I would certainly appreciate some advice on the topic. What will 4 more strenuous shouting performances do to already strained vocal chords? Recommended healing?

Thanks & God Bless.

Jeff
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Unread 03-24-2005, 12:20 PM   #20
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Jeff-

My non-professional advice?

My qualifications: 40 hours of singing in two weeks for a Messiah Performance. My voice was shot. Here's what I did:

1. Rest my voice all day. Don't talk unless you have to. When you do talk, speak in as normal of a light voice as you canódon't let your voice rumble and growl, keep your pitch relatively high.

2. Drink water. Water is good.

3. Green tea with honey. I'm a fan. Make sure you follow it up with water, to keep the vocal folds hydrated

4. Yell from your gut. Yelling can be done correctly. It needn't strain your voice.
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Unread 03-24-2005, 01:49 PM   #21
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Higher pitches are absent from my range in my current state. Are you suggesting that if I have to speak, I should try to aim for a higher pitch or is it just that I should simply not let a rough, hoarse voice be spoken?
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Unread 03-24-2005, 03:49 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeff-q
Higher pitches are absent from my range in my current state. Are you suggesting that if I have to speak, I should try to aim for a higher pitch or is it just that I should simply not let a rough, hoarse voice be spoken?
Often people let their voice drop below their actual optimal speaking voice pitch. This is harmful for your voice. If you split your full voice(meaning, chest voice) into three parts, your optimal speaking pitch is somwhere around the split between the two top thirds.

So basically, don't let your voice drop to unnatural pitches because it seems easier.
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Unread 03-25-2005, 09:25 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thud
I donít think you are rude at all, Amy, and I hope you wonít think I am either. But Iíve never seen or experienced all this danger you speak of. I know people whoíve done permanent damage to knees, backs, and shoulders, but I donít know of anybody whoís done permanent damage to their voice, or had to have surgery. The only person Iíve ever heard of who canít sing anymore is David Lee Roth. Does anybody here really know someone who sang so hard they canít sing at all any more? That has to be extremely rare.

Iíve only heard this damage-to-your-voice paranoia in choir settings, which is puzzling to me because I never even got a decent vocal workout in the choirs Iíve been in. In pop/rock settings the discussion is always about techniques that allow you to sing long gigs several times a week. The most popular singers are not gentle with their voices, but they find ways to keep doing what they do for many years. Steven Curtis Chapman can growl and scream with the best, but he has the conditioning and technique to get away with it and still sound pretty on the softer songs. Mac Powell, Mark Stuart, and Steve Wiggins have been growling out tunes for a long time. They can still carry a tune and people love their voices. You can bet they never saw a decent vocal coach until after they were successful.

I donít think the voice is fragile Ė itís a lot tougher than knees and shoulders! It doesnít have cartilage, itís just muscle and skin rubbing together. Iíve read that surgical intervention is called for when lesions on the vocal folds wonít heal, but I donít know anybody whoís had to have that done. Iíve blown my voice out pretty badly twice (once was singing) but it was fully recovered in a couple of months. The best therapy was singing (not screaming). Everybody who sings pushes their voice too hard sometimes and you canít even understand the concepts of good coaching without quite a bit of singing experience, yet everybody I know has survived this abuse.

I never want to sound like Mark Stuart myself, but gritty-voiced rock singers are always in demand. You really can do this without something bad and permanent happening.
Thespia already mentioned Julie Andrews (the example I was going to give ). Also, a good friend of mine developed nodes on her vocal chords from singing improperly, and can't really sing anymore at all (which is a shame, because she had a beautiful voice). One of my voice teacher's best friends ruined her vocal chords by cheerleading, and another did some serious damage by overusing her voice (she was prescribed "no talking/singing/anything" for three months, and she mostly recovered). No damage to your voice is ever good.

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Unread 04-03-2005, 08:30 PM   #24
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ok, so what does everyone suggest to work on screaming without demolishing your voice?
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