[barefooter]

Yesterday, in my New Testament Perspectives class, we discussed Jesus's healing of the madman in the tombs (Mark 5). We were presented with four possible explinations for biblical demon posession.

1). Mental illness- The society that biblical writers were a part of did not know about mental illness, and so they attributed it to demon posession. The swine running into the lake was just part of the healing-Messiah myth, symbolizing the healing of the man.

2). Accomodation- Jesus knew that the society that he was a part of didn't know about mental illness, so he played along and pretended to remove demons when he was, in fact, just curing the man's mental disorders.

3). Gradual Elimination- There were demons in the first century, but since Christ's resurrection they have taken a serious hit in power, and are in retreat.

4). Realism- The Bible said it like it was, and it's the same way today.

Personally, I lean towards gradual elimination, with some qualification. There are a few instances in the Old Testament that could be attributed to demonic activity, and a few instances were documented after Christ's resurrection; however, I believe that, for the most part, the demonic activity mentioned in the New Testament was an outbreak directly related to Christ's physically being on the earth.

[Jay42]

Originally Posted by barefooter

I believe that, for the most part, the demonic activity mentioned in the New Testament was an outbreak directly related to Christ's physically being on the earth.

Oooh, I like, I like! I hadn't thought of that before.

Demonology hurts my head. It's definitely not well-outlined in scripture.

[Gracie Love]

So if you were just taught that demons manifest like mental illness, is it not possible that there are many demons on the Earth today that are manifesting as mental illness?


I do believe in Possessions. I have seen 5 personally. I have also seen demons try to attack different things but they only have power if you give them power.

[Deren]

Quite acurate and quite right about the mental illnesses in the New Testimate.
This cleraly also has proof outlined in scripture:
Mat 8:
16 When the even was come, they brought unto him many that were possessed with devils: and he cast out the spirits with his word, and healed all that were sick:
17 That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying, Himself took our infirmities, and bare our sicknesses.

Clearly here is a passage in scritpure talking about cast out "spirits" that were "devil possesed" which fulfilled the prophosy of Isaiah saying that he took our "infirmities and our sickness" THere is that clear distinction between sickenss and demons/devils being the same thing.

Many more instances occur to show this is true but I don't remember the off the top of my head. I'll post them later if need be.

peace,
-Deren

[Mike Graham]

About the same as Versh here, maybe somewhere between 3 and 4. Demons are actual living creatures that afflict people. These were especially prevalent with the arrival of Christ on Earth, but not limited to that. They are unable to occupy Christians to the best of my knowledge, and they can be cast out in the name of Christ with prayer, and fasting in certain circumstances.

[barefooter]

Originally Posted by Gracie Love

I do believe in Possessions. I have seen 5 personally.

Personal experience =/= Biblical truth. I could say that I do not believe in demonic posession because I have never seen a posession.

I do not, however, take that view.

I have also seen demons try to attack different things but they only have power if you give them power.

Huh? Where in the Bible is this?

[ChrisHarbison]

Originally Posted by Barefooter

3). Gradual Elimination- There were demons in the first century, but since Christ's resurrection they have taken a serious hit in power, and are in retreat.

I think this is the closest thing to the truth of demonic activity that we'll come up with. This is where I'd stand given the 4 options I have to choose from.

Originally Posted by Jay42

Demonology hurts my head. It's definitely not well-outlined in scripture.

You are certainly correct about that. The Bible is virtually silent on the issue.

Originally Posted by Gracie Love

So if you were just taught that demons manifest like mental illness, is it not possible that there are many demons on the Earth today that are manifesting as mental illness?

No, because we can look at the physiology of the human brain and see a different between "normal" brains and "mentally ill" brains. So I'm not real inclined to accept this as fact.

Originally Posted by Gracie Love

I do believe in Possessions. I have seen 5 personally. I have also seen demons try to attack different things but they only have power if you give them power.

I highly doubt this.

[Dr. Doom]

just wondering, what do modern demon possessions look like?

[rkbo]

Here is a few things to consider
Mark 3:22-26
22 And the scribes which came down from Jerusalem said, He hath Beelzebub, and by the prince of the devils casteth he out devils.
23 And he called them unto him, and said unto them in parables, How can Satan cast out Satan?
24 And if a kingdom be divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand.
25 And if a house be divided against itself, that house cannot stand.
26 And if Satan rise up against himself, and be divided, he cannot stand, but hath an end.
(KJV)

You see how Jesus doesn't even hint at mental illness he refers to a spiritual kingdom


Mark 3:11
11 And unclean spirits, when they saw him, fell down before him, and cried, saying, Thou art the Son of God.
(KJV)

James 2:19
19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
(KJV)


We see here that demons have an intellect. They are persons.

2 Pet 2:4
4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;
(KJV)

Jude 1:6
6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.
(KJV)

Could you judge a mental illness?


Eph 6:12
12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
(KJV)

Notice what is not flesh and blood, IE. Principalities, powers, rulers of the darkness of this world, spiritual wickedness in high places.
Oh yes these demons are real and to say they do not posses people today is nothing more than a personal opinion.

[Dr. Doom]

Originally Posted by rkbo

Could you judge a mental illness?

yeah, i'd just look at you! ziiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiing!

[exo]

Originally Posted by Dr. Doom

just wondering, what do modern demon possessions look like?

*Points to Dr. Doom's avatar*

[Dr. Doom]

Originally Posted by exo

*Points to Dr. Doom's avatar*

doh! i'd give you rep if i hadn't given too much today.

[Blindman]

Originally Posted by ChrisHarbison

No, because we can look at the physiology of the human brain and see a different between "normal" brains and "mentally ill" brains. So I'm not real inclined to accept this as fact.

1) Demons can cause physical illnesses in people (see Lk 13:10-17, the woman crippled by an evil spirit). So why can't demons cause mental illness?

2) Our thoughts and actions influence the physiology of our brains, not just the other way around. So it's perfectly reasonable to say that a spiritual problem could create physical side effects in someone's brain.

[Gracie Love]

Originally Posted by Dr. Doom

just wondering, what do modern demon possessions look like?

What do they look like? That is not the easiest question to answer, but I can tell you what I have seen. I have seen it manifest in illness.

I have seen it just straight up pocess a person to where the room they were in was ice cold where the rest of the house was warm and there was not reason for that room to be cold. Two people I know were in that room and one was sweating and was laying down as if he were in a coma. the other was speaking in a voice that was not him and too low for him to even make. Also when I look into his eyes there were flames in his eyes. When I started praying for them and praising God and Jesus. He looked up at me and said there is no God. I just kept on Praising God. The Demon came out of him and tried to attack me. But was unable. Finally I had to get someone else to come and pray for them with me.

[Gracie Love]

Originally Posted by Blindman

1) Demons can cause physical illnesses in people (see Lk 13:10-17, the woman crippled by an evil spirit). So why can't demons cause mental illness?

2) Our thoughts and actions influence the physiology of our brains, not just the other way around. So it's perfectly reasonable to say that a spiritual problem could create physical side effects in someone's brain.

Right on. What about the women witht the affliction of Blood for 18 years. Luke 13:10-13. That story was also in Matthew. It was called and illness(infirmity) and an unclean spirit.