[SccHarpGirl]

*bangs head on keyboard*

For the sake of those that seemed to miss it, believe it or not I was NOT advocating high school homeschooling! Here is what I said:

I'll preface this by saying that despite these problems, I was glad that I chose to do regular school for high school, beacuse there are certain things you need in High school that honestly you can't get homeschooling. And if you have a strong faith base from years of homeschooling, and a strong sense of self, you'll be fine. But....

Did I say anywhere that the educational system had no value, or that it was inferior to homeschooling in all respects? NO

What I was trying to get across was that it is not perfect, it has lots of problems.

[BillSPrestonEsq]

all the systems, especially public, (which to me seems to produce drones not thinkers as a group) have problems. I will probebly homeschool, but both me and my fiance are going for Masters, and maybe doctorates so I don't think it will be some dumb non-high school graduate, doing the teaching.

[Travis]

Originally posted by Ridley's Own
Sure can.

The quote you produced was not the same as what you were maintaining that I said.

[Colleen]

Originally posted by SCCHarpGirl
*bangs head on keyboard*

For the sake of those that seemed to miss it, believe it or not I was NOT advocating high school homeschooling!

Did I say anywhere that the educational system had no value, or that it was inferior to homeschooling in all respects? NO

What I was trying to get across was that it is not perfect, it has lots of problems.

If you took my thoughts as a direct response to you, sorry. I wasn't aiming at any particular person, just explaining my view and dispelling a few stereotypes. I think this is a hard issue to debate because I feel it's generally agreed that there's no perfect, biblically-commanded solution. :P

[HisAngelGrlCA]

i haven't exactly had too much time to read the entire 5-page thread, but i do have an opinion on homeschooling v. public school.

I'm in 10th grade right now, and i am currently homeschooled. Throughout 5th-9th grade i went to public school. But this year, i decided to be homeschooled. Alot had gone on in my life, the Lord spoke to me, and i knew in my heart that homeschooling was the best way to go.

In 9th grade, being homeschooled was a threat by my parents when certain situations occured that were against God's desires. But now, i see it as a real priveledge to be able to be homeschooled.

To make this as short as possible, my view on homeschooling versus public school stands as;
If you are in a public school and you know in your heart that you aren't where you should be spiritually, pray about being homeschooled. Your decision totally depends on what the Lord shows you to do, not what other people "think". Choosing between public school and Homeschooling is a very tough decision, but its very personal too.
Honestly, being homeschooled has completely allowed my spiritual life to blossom in many ways more than one. It is probably one of the best decisions i've ever made. When i was in public school, over a period of time, i became spiritually drained. It was hard to go through it all and it wasnt worth the social life i had. Although i must say, i know people that have been homeschooled their entire life, sadly, they aren't exactly where they should be socially. You can see that they don't have much of a social life at all only because the skills needed to be developed are not there.

I will admit, i had a really cool social life in public school, but on a scale between 1 and 10, the social life i had in public school was about a 3, only because it was really bad for my spiritual life, and my current social life, i'd give it a 10+
I would never go back to public school. It is really easy to backslide, but thank God He so graciously spared me from that. Public school isn't even worth contemplating as an option opposed to homeschooling. Its not worth the spiritual pain you will experience.

I have a lot more to say about all this, but it's 4:57 a.m. and i need sleep, i've been out all day. I'll come back here later.

[+Donny]

The state (in this context, TN or TX) has a responsibility to make sure they have a reasonably educated electorate. That's the whole point of public education in the first place.

And I disagree with the point of public education. Not everythingis under the jurisdiction of the state. The state is merely one of three (well, four) governments.

Wrong. It is the state's jurisdiction, because the state has the responsibility to make sure a reasonably educated electorate. Would you want a non-certified Christian surgeon operating on you? Or a non-certified Christian mechanic operating on your brakes?

I dont care if they arent certified, I care if they are good. There is nothing wrong with certification per se, but in a free market, if someone doesnt perform, they dont succeed whether they are certified or not.

This is an issue of wanting your cake and eating it, too.

I think state certification is completely stupid, especially once they start telling parents who and who cannot educate their children. If the state is non-Christian and grows against Christianity, it will not certify those who teach from a biblical standpoint. Thats not good at all.

And finally, it is not the state's jurisdiction. If you seek to prove so, do it; dont just assert it. The bible gives no support that I have seen.

Sigh... Donny, this only shows that you have filled your mind with not much more than right-wing propaganda. Here is a link to the
Southeastern Association of Colleges and Schools Commission on Secondary and Middle School's accreditation standards. Please find some semblence of 'humanist system of requirements.' Perhaps if you actually read what was required of SACS schools, you wouldn't be relying so heavily on absurdist rhetoric to defend your position.

Actually, if there is accredidation should be Christian, just like anything else. If it exists, it should required Christian teachings, not secular.
Finally, arguing even more, I have seen more than a couple stories of law schools that either couldnt get accredited and had to change their methods on things to get accredited because of their heavy Christian leanings and teachings.

Wrong. You are not going to get an engineering certification, required by many, many states, without at least a bachelors.

Not true. My dad is an engineer (environmental) and all you need to do is pass a test (I think).

Please think about this for a moment, will you? Would you really want a doctor operating on you that had 'on the job training' as their only education?

I would ask around and see if he is reliable.

Would you want a civil engineer building a dam in your community that had 'on the job training' as their only education?

I would look at what he has done in the past and see if he is reliable.

At what point does 'trial and error' as and educational paradigm actually begin to be hazardous to the lives of patients and citizens?

Public education is hardly flawless.

I agree, to a certain extent. However, the government has a responsibility to have an adequetly educated electorate. The School's only responsibility should be to educate students, NOT turn a profit for shareholders.

Prove that the state has such a responsibility. I disagree and affirm (biblically) that it is the family's jurisdiction.

What you wind up with is a class of the well-educated rich, an adequetly educated middle class, and a poorly educated poor.

If you are poor, you cant afford as great an education. So what? that makes sense.

However, you presuppose two things: 1)there would be sharp class divisions
2)the poor wouldnt get good education

though I find nothing wrong with richer people obtaining a better education because of their good financial decisions.

Public shools are not 'socialistic.' We've had public schools since the 1700s. A good education is not a luxury. It is a requirement for a democracy to work.

You are yet to show how this requires public education.

Good God A'mighty! Do you even know why we even have socio-economic class divisions? Ancient cultures didn't have the economy to support any class at all. So unless you're suggesting we go back to being hunter-gatherers, I suggest you quit writing this garbage.

Yes, because they did not have specialized labor divisions. However, capitalism does not create this rigid class division. If anything, socialism does.

And what about those that work hard, and remain poor? Like my grandfather, who worked 20+ years in a coal mine in KY, was transfered to an aluminium plant and died when my father was 15, leaving a widow to raise 4 children on a pension that was a quarter of his monthly salary? Do you realize that I am the first person my dad's side of the family that has not been an industrial laborer?

1)do we trust example over scripture
2)i dont doubt it. However, we must look at the reasons he was poor and the environment. High taxes, family history, inheritances, everything.

Donny, to be quite frank, quit blowing things out your ***. You're 16. You don't know squat about how the world functions. And sitting at home with your head buried in a book is not going to teach you anything about reality. You remind me of some of my professors, wiling their time away in an ivory tower, unconcerned with reality, focusing solely on theory. Its sad, really, because you've got so much potential, but you're pissing it away on theory and academic delusions.

Ill try to ignore how utterly offensive that was and get down to the actualy content of it.

How do you expect me to learn? Im 16. What do you want me to do? get a job? Im trying. Learn? I am. What else?

[waqi13]

donny, i take it you are not poor, otherwise your attitude would be very different. MAny people who are poor are not poor by their own factors, being born into poverty, not being able to get a job, different factors that contribute to being poor etc, most of the time not of thei own doing,

education is the best way out of poverty, read one of your books and you should see that, as it is a widely accepted principle. that is why public education is so important, poor people dont get rich all of a sudden, rich pple can stay rich, they dont even need the education, but poor pple need to learn skills, so then they can get a job and earn money, etc so they become non poor people. it is not alrite for poor pple to have a poor education, poor pple need all the oppurtunities they can get, JEsus taught that we should help the poor, there shouldnt even be rich pple if you follow Jesus example and teachings

MArk 10:23

And jesus looked round about them and saith unto his disciples, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!

25 it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, then for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

[+Donny]

donny, i take it you are not poor, otherwise your attitude would be very different. MAny people who are poor are not poor by their own factors, being born into poverty, not being able to get a job, different factors that contribute to being poor etc, most of the time not of thei own doing,

I acknowledged this.

education is the best way out of poverty, read one of your books and you should see that, as it is a widely accepted principle. that is why public education is so important, poor people dont get rich all of a sudden, rich pple can stay rich, they dont even need the education, but poor pple need to learn skills, so then they can get a job and earn money, etc so they become non poor people. it is not alrite for poor pple to have a poor education, poor pple need all the oppurtunities they can get, JEsus taught that we should help the poor, there shouldnt even be rich pple if you follow Jesus example and teachings

You are under the illusion that charity would be non-existant. That is not true. There would still be plenty of charities for scholarships for education and people should still give to people. But does what you said justify the government unjustly taking our money away to provide "free" education to the poor? No, for charity is an option.

[Amanda]

Figured I'd throw in my two cents.

I'm a senior at a medium-sized private Christian school, and it has both its advantages and disadvantages. The main complaint I have is that in an environment like that it's very easy to fake your Christianity; you get trained in the outward actions, as opposed to your heart. Besides, spirituality basically gets forced down your throat. There are people here who literally hate God and Christianity and everything, and they're treated like a social case ("we've got to fix them somehow"). It's scary.

On the other hand, the closeness is nice. The entire senior class consists of 24 people, and the other classes aren't a whole lot bigger, so everyone knows who everyone is, we look out for each other, etc. Anyone who tries to throw that off gets a severe lecture (or beating... ) from us. (Gossip tends to spread pretty fast, but ya know...)

At any rate, I think that the school choice really depends on the kid, and his or her needs and social skills and learning rate. I'll probably put my kids in public school, even if it's just for a few years, but I suppose I'll cross that bridge when I get to it. Several of my friends are home-schooled and they're definitely well-rounded, social, intelligent individuals. On the other hand, I'd be a horrible home schooler b/c I have very little discipline--I have to have someone on my case all the time to get me to learn anything. So I suppose it's rather subjective.

[raggedyandy7]

being homeschooled my whole life i know ALLLL about the pros and cons about it. for one my dad has been a speaker on homeschool for 13 years and he knows it backwards and forwards. Many colleges give extra scholarships to homeschoolers cuz in the most case (i am not saying ALLLLL cuz i know there are a lot of bummed out lunatic homeschoolers) they are dilligent in their work and they know what they are doing. statistics show that homeschoolers naturally do better than public schools and some private schools on their SAT's.

To those who are saying that u have no social life in homeschooling. OMG give me a break!!! As a homeschooler i played basketball, baseball, choir (sorta, i sucked), Honors english class, chemistry, algebra (didnt help me much), biology classes. There are SOOOO many extra-curricular activities for homeschoolers. We even have a "all sports day" here in houston that my parents and some other homeschoolers started about 8 years ago. Our basketball team here in houston is ranked in the top 10 in private schools...and has been in the top 3 at nationals for the past 5 years. In some cities, not all cities, home schoolers can play volleyball, baseball, dance, choir, basketball, and many other activities.

All the states ask you to do with your students is meet the standards for a high school student and do all the subjects that are necessary to be a high school student. Being home-schooled u are ALSO able to be taught from a christian back ground. and also wake up WHENEVER WE WANT TO!!! sort of:kroll: Also dont have to worry about when the next psychomaniac with a sub-machine gun is gonna come in and "bust a cap". My friend goes to a Christian private school here in houston and says that more than half of the students there do drugs and some of the time are even high while going to class. We also have a graduating class every year...my graduating class was over 150 students.


Dont get me wrong tho, homeschooling isnt for everyone, some parents both the husband and wife work and its sort of pointless homeschooling then. But in the most case its the mom that is at home and is working with the children which brings a stronger bond between family members, on most occasions. It realy depends on the family and the kid, and also on the choices of schools in the area.

I havnt had time to read everyones post but i thought id just say something, its 1am and i cant remember what i actually wanted to say now. darn. ill remember later. if u want stats about homeschoolers vs public/private schools i may be able to get them, not sure. Well im off to bed. nite

[followerofJESUS]

Yea, home schooling sure isn't for everyone. But the public schools should not be under the jurisdiction of the federal government. They should be local schools, regulated by the local people. Not huge systems creating uneducated drones who are indoctrinated in the immaturity of the hundreds of immature peers around them under the mask of "equal-education".

I'm not saying this is always the case. Some exceptional students do come out of the public school system. However, on a general basis, the public school system ultimately encourages immaturity, pride, and uneducated masses. Which is, by the way, what is was intended to do.

Like Raggedy's dad, mine is also very knowledgeable on the history of public schooling, and the proper biblical method of schooling. Ever heard of the Dewey decimal system? Well, Dewey played a huge part in creating our nation's public school system.

His public school plan was designed to create uneducated masses where a few educated members of the elite class would rule the country. The majority of the population would thus be unable to reach their full potential, so as not to threaten the ruling elite.


Of course, his plan was not fully implemented, but you can see some of the basic goals shining through in today’s public schools.