Knowingly Sinning

gal4gzus · 11-19-2002, 09:50 PM

Hey! This is actually the first time I've actually posted anything on this site at all, but I have a very important question.
I have many extended family members who say they are Christians, and have been for quite a while, but continually, knowing sin. They act like they don't care that they are sinning. Example being, divorce. We've tried to explain to my aunt that she shouldn't be instigating the divorce with her husband. We've tried lectures, we've tried giving her the scriptures, and we've tried just praying with her, but she just doesn't get it. My question is this, can you genuinely be saved when you are knowingly disobeying God? The Bible says, multiple times, that God is Merciful and forgives, but it also says that God is not mocked.
Thanks!

Raphael · 11-19-2002, 11:44 PM

That's a tough one (perhaps the question should also be asked in Theology)

Question, what are her reasons for getting a divorce? If it's Marital unfaithfulness, than it is still ok. (Though as Smitty can testify, when a couple overcomes that it is more glorifying to God than if they got a divorce)

GMartin2R · 11-20-2002, 12:06 AM

yeah defin9itely a tough situation...

really the only thing i can tell you is really what you know. though roger brought up a great point about why is she divorcing. my aunt is in process of a divorce but my uncle was caught in multiple affairs so i beliueve that one is justified.

what i will say though, you mentioned you tried praying, imo that's the best thing you can do. at least that's the best advice i can give. there are probably others here who can offer better insight thani can but prayer is a powerful thing.

Dr. Worm · 11-20-2002, 01:44 AM

Since I became a christian, I have knowingly sinned. I have known that the thing I was about to do was sinful, and I went ahead and did it anyway. Was it stupid of me? Very. Do I regret it? Yes, very much. But I still knowingly sinned, and was still a christian.

Singin4Him82 · 11-20-2002, 09:06 AM

I can't really relate to this question gal4gzus. I have an aunt who is believer and has been for years now but 4 years ago she got a divorce and is now about to marry a man she met on the internet in a over 40's chat room. Now the divorce she had was acceptable even though I don't believe in divorce because she has a 10 yr old son and an 8 yr old daughter and their father was dangerous being a drug addict, drinking around the kids and becoming abusive to my aunt. So she finally decided the best thing to do was divorce to get the children out of harms way with him. Those children are very problemed now though due to their home life and they both have ADD. When my aunt met this man onlnie she stated neglecting her children by coming straight home from work and hopping right on the computer until she went to bed leaving her 21 yr old daughter who lives there as well to take on the role of mother. She's now about to marry this man she's only seen in person a totaly of maybe 15 times and he's been married 4 times before and is not a strong believer if one at all. This is a scary situation she hardly knows this man and is marrying him and moving herself and her two younger children to MS. She only cares about herself and her feelings, her younger children don't know this man at all as they've only spent 2 days with him because when he comes to visit or she has visited him she won't allow them to be around because they're so problemed and hyper at times. So despite the fact that our whole family(her brothers, brothers wives, parents, niece and nephews) are all against it she doesn't care, even though we all don't feel this is a good idea because of how little she's been around him yet. Although she may know him more than we think I believe she has been knowingly sinning by disrespecting the advice of family and most importantly neglecting her children.

The best advice I can give is just keep talkin and keep praying! She may never listen and things may go the way she wants but in time she will have to deal with the choices she makes just as my aunt will herself. Keep praying!

GRibbit · 11-20-2002, 11:56 AM

I feel ya. I've got family members...immediate family members, who say they are Christians, but knowingly disobey God. Cussing, hating, looking at things that are not to be looked at, I've tried talking to them, showing them in the Word where it says what they're doing is wrong, etc, just as you have. The only thing you can really do, like these people before me have said, is pray for her. Be there to support your aunt, she knows what you think of it...whether she listens or not, she does hear you...now, what she does is btwn her and God. Like Delaina said, she will have to live with her choices. As will we all.
I'm praying with you!

ShinDock · 11-20-2002, 04:17 PM

gal4gzus

Quote:

My question is this, can you genuinely be saved when you are knowingly disobeying God? The Bible says, multiple times, that God is Merciful and forgives, but it also says that God is not mocked.
Thanks!

To bluntly answer your question, no. If you know what's right, and don't do it, that's sin. (James 4:17). Disobeying God knowingly, and being unrepentant for what you've done, does not equal salvation.

Now then, that doesn't mean we can judge people and say whether they're saved or not. (Matt. 7:1) That's something only God can do. All we can do is show them the way, and pray for them, which is exactly what you're doing. The whole chapter of Matthew 18 is a great guide for dealing with people in known sin. We need to have a humble attitude, not one of self-righteousness. We need to show perserverance. If your own advice fails, bring a select few later on. And finally, we must be willing to forgive, even till 70 times 7.

Hope and pray everything works out for you.

***BillSPrestonEsq*** · 11-20-2002, 04:33 PM

shindock I disagree, sometimes Christians willfully sin.

guitargurl' · 11-20-2002, 04:41 PM

My grandmother got divorsed when I was about 4 or 5.she had cought her husband cheating on her several times, and she tried for 11 years to change him, but he still didn't change, when she filed for divorse, he said he got saved, n' was different now, but after a year, he was the same, so they got divorsed.and i really belive she had gruonds for divorse, n' it turned out 2 b a good thing!
about the sinning thing, I got saved 3months ago tommorow!

and there have been a few times when i have done something wrong, knowing it was wrong.

and afterwards, i felt like the most awful, stupid person alive!!!every time i mess-up, I have to go to God and ask for forgivness!And, thank goodness, He loves me, and, He is a forgiving God, and I kno' He'll allways love me!

ShinDock · 11-20-2002, 06:14 PM

Bill
[q]shindock I disagree, sometimes Christians willfully sin.[/q]

I agree, sometimes Christians willfully sin. Obviously that's not a good thing, but that's why there's a thing called forgiveness. But I don't think that's what we're disagreeing about.

As I understood it, the question asked "Can you be saved while you're knowingly doing something wrong?" My answer was no. Now I don't want to put words in your mouth, but are you telling me we're in a saving relationship with Christ when we're sinning? That it's okay to sin, it doesn't really matter, just so long as you're a Christian? Because if that's the case, what's the point in confessing to God and asking for forgiveness? What's the point in trying to live a good, honest, moral life, if you can sin without remorse?

I don't like misrepresenting people, so if you could clarify your statement further, I'd appreciate it.

barefooter · 11-20-2002, 07:13 PM

*whoohoo*! I love OSAS debates!

And I have to concur with Doc Worm.

gal4gzus · 11-20-2002, 09:12 PM

Thanks so much for all of your input! It's really awesome to see people debating on stuff like this:-) I think I did leave something out though. Deliberately, continuously, AND knowingly sinning altogether in one. If she IS saved, then she would have MAJOR conviction about it, right? But, eventually God would say, okay, she's not listening and basically, not convict her about that particular things, and God would have to give her the consequences...right? This is just a major subject that my mom and I have talked about, so, it's really on my mind. Thanks guys!

**Athanasius** · 11-21-2002, 01:15 AM

This should really be moved to "Theology"...

Peace.

Raphael · 11-22-2002, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bob_The_Veggie
This should really be moved to "Theology"...

Peace.

Didn't I already say that?

gal4gzus, the question does remain: Why is she getting divorced?

gal4gzus · 11-22-2002, 10:23 PM

Sorry about not answering your question! They started out in a "partying" life-style and she "changed" and he didn't. And so she resented that and tried to change him, but of course, he didn't.