Tolkien a Christian?

Bryan · 10-05-2002, 11:28 PM

go talk about the pope in another thread. not this one. this is not a thread about the pope, it is a thread about tolkein.

SccHarpGirl · 10-05-2002, 11:34 PM

point taken. But ultimately the question will come down to are Catholics christian or not, because all the evidence states that Tolkien was a devout Catholic. So those who say that he's not a christian are the same that say that catholics are not christian.

So therefore the response to this thread can be thus: Tolkien was a devout, practicing Catholic. If you believe that Catholics are christian, then he's a christian. If you believe that they're not, then he's not

/

rredboy · 10-05-2002, 11:34 PM

the issue at hand is if Tolien is indeed a christian, and if i show the pope claiming to be something he is not, and as the pope being the leader of Tolkiens "religion" insisting that he is thee manifestation of christ, then that should pretty much debunk him.

SccHarpGirl · 10-05-2002, 11:36 PM

Still, I highly doubt this. Want to prove it?

rredboy · 10-05-2002, 11:50 PM

lemme start a new thread......

SccHarpGirl · 10-05-2002, 11:51 PM

sure. whatever you want

classicalsam · 10-06-2002, 06:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by rredboy
Tolkien is a catholic with a few very unscriptural beleifs.

I must say that I know many Protestants with very unscriptural beliefs...yes there are theological issues with the Catholic Church, but the fact that someone is a member of this Church doesn't automatically disqualify them from being a Christian! sam in israel

SccHarpGirl · 10-06-2002, 02:14 PM

well said Sam

Amanda · 10-06-2002, 02:49 PM

Good job, Sam. The same probably goes for the Orthodox Church, too.

Finally, we're talking about something other than soteriology or eschatology for once...

rredboy · 10-06-2002, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SCCHarpGirl
I doubt he would have said that about Jesus. I bet it was manifestation of St. Peter.

either way, peter died and all that is left is some of his words in the bible. Him claiming to be the manifestation of peter would be like me trying to say i am the physical manifestation of TImothy.

about that verse with jesus and peter.

I personally think that jesus was basing the church on the idea the jesus is the messiah, the christ. Jesus was happy peter had faith in him before he told them.

But like peter, we too have the power to loose things. (2cor 4:13)

Travis · 10-06-2002, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rredboy
the thing i have a problem with is he says he is THE physical (representation/manifestation) i forgot which it was, i think is was acutally manifestatation, but im not sure. Anyways the meaning like the only one.

That meaning would only be the case if he said "the manifestation." Until you produce a verifiable quote or a clip of him saying that exactly you have no grounds to say such.

rredboy · 10-06-2002, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by classicalsam
I must say that I know many Protestants with very unscriptural beliefs...yes there are theological issues with the Catholic Church, but the fact that someone is a member of this Church doesn't automatically disqualify them from being a Christian! sam in israel

the difference is, there are a million denominaitons of protestant, so you can't really pin stuff on a specific denomination because even down to the level of the individual church, is different, but the Roman Catholics are all the same,

But like i mentioned earlier, the pope claimed to be the physical manifestation of christ.

Bryan · 10-06-2002, 09:11 PM

please do not discuss Catholicism here, I have already asked this once. Catholics are considered part of Chrsitianity at large by the majority of protestant believers. Therefore, if Tolkein was a Catholic, he was a Christian. If you want to talk about whether Catholics are truly Christian do it in another thread.

**Chrysostom** · 10-06-2002, 09:16 PM

(rredboy) Tolkien is a catholic with a few very unscriptural beleifs.

(Me) Quite honestly, you're a Charismatic with a vast number of very unscriptural beliefs. Does that preclude your inclusion in the Covenant?

brown07 · 10-07-2002, 02:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by rredboy
either way, peter died and all that is left is some of his words in the bible.

All that is left are some words that he wrote?... Jesus said that Peter was a rock and on him he would build his church. I would say that much more than some words are left from Peter. Please be more careful with your rhetoric. I found that to be particularly offensive.

And I think that the Catholic Church's claims have mostly to do simply with the Pope being the continuation of Peter's office, given to him by Christ. I disagree with this claim, but I do not find it to incorrect to the point of calling all Catholics pagan.