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Unread 11-22-2016, 06:41 AM   #1
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I found a great resource the other day on bad history and atheism, by atheist historian Tim O'Neill.

This is a great resource for discussions on Jesus Mythicism, the myth of the "Dark Ages" and other propagated distortions that usually serve an ideological function of embarrassing Christianity.

http://historyforatheists.blogspot.co.uk/?m=1

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Unread 12-02-2016, 08:45 PM   #2
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O'Neill also runs a medievalist blog called Armarium Magnum.

His stuff has a bit of a polemical edge so he can be pretty funny. Good writer. Not a vocational scholar, so he tends to take the view a few books as a given and proceed from there. The good thing is he cites his sources well, so you can be clear on the authority and decide for yourself to what extent you trust that authority. The bad thing is that sometimes he elides over some important distinctions in order to serve his overall point.
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Unread 12-03-2016, 10:46 AM   #3
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Yeah, I remember reading his post on the Hypatia movie Agora. He didn't like it.
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Unread 12-03-2016, 12:44 PM   #4
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Also, I love the graph he calls "The Most Wrong Thing On the Internet Ever." It is hilariously stupid:

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Unread 12-03-2016, 01:34 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Chrysostom View Post
Not a vocational scholar, so he tends to take the view a few books as a given and proceed from there.
I do? Strange - I seem to recall reading many, many books on any of the topics I write about and tend to avoid subjects that I haven't studied in depth. So can you back up this odd "a few books" claim?

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The bad thing is that sometimes he elides over some important distinctions in order to serve his overall point.
Gosh. Got any evidence of me doing this "bad thing"?
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Unread 12-03-2016, 04:40 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TimONeill View Post
I do? Strange - I seem to recall reading many, many books on any of the topics I write about and tend to avoid subjects that I haven't studied in depth. So can you back up this odd "a few books" claim?



Gosh. Got any evidence of me doing this "bad thing"?
Hey Tim! Welcome to the forum.

Your reputation precedes you.

I'm kinda new here, and not in any way a scholar, but enjoy anything that debunks atheists. My last foray into philosophy was probably reading Schaeffer's Complete Works some 30 years ago. (not supporting him, but enjoyed a lot of his ideas). As a lay minister living in Japan, I deal with supposed atheism all the time, and come to the conclusion that most actually believe in god, usually the one in the mirror ... a very distorted mirror!

Anyway, I've not much to add to any deep academic discussion, but if this leads to anything to do with our daily life in Christ while living in a perverse generation, I'm all in!

And don't mind me too much, I'm just an old geezer.

Cheers and goodness to you in Christ Jesus!
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Unread 12-03-2016, 04:56 PM   #7
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I do? Strange - I seem to recall reading many, many books on any of the topics I write about and tend to avoid subjects that I haven't studied in depth. So can you back up this odd "a few books" claim?

Gosh. Got any evidence of me doing this "bad thing"?
Whoa! The Tim! I follow you on Quora! You once commented on an answer I wrote on atheism and biblical writings. I'm a NT doctoral student, btw. Love your stuff. You obviously care about history and don't seem to give into ideology. Very grateful of that.
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Yes... I am the official "Knight Who Will Write Something On Derrida".
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"outside of a dog a book is a man's best friend... inside a dog it is too dark to read."
-groucho marx

Quote:
Originally Posted by Demon_Hunter View Post
Taylor, you just got drive-by theologied.

Last edited by Uptown Thrunk; 12-05-2016 at 02:34 PM.
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Unread 12-04-2016, 07:23 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by TimONeill View Post
I do? Strange - I seem to recall reading many, many books on any of the topics I write about and tend to avoid subjects that I haven't studied in depth. So can you back up this odd "a few books" claim?

Gosh. Got any evidence of me doing this "bad thing"?
Wait did it actually work? Honestly I wanted to see how attuned you were to the goings-on across the web.

Personally if I have to choose I'll skew toward vigor rather than rigor, if you get the distinction. But I'm not the only one here.

The first order of business is, of course, to say hello and welcome. So -- hello. And welcome!
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Unread 12-05-2016, 01:08 AM   #9
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Wait did it actually work? Honestly I wanted to see how attuned you were to the goings-on across the web.

Personally if I have to choose I'll skew toward vigor rather than rigor, if you get the distinction. But I'm not the only one here.

The first order of business is, of course, to say hello and welcome. So -- hello. And welcome!
My blog tracks hits back to the source. But you didn't answer my questions above. And what lack of "rigor"? I'm sorry, but I try to be as rigorous as possible and I don't take too kindly to people claiming otherwise. Please back up your accusation that I'm not rigorous.
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Unread 12-05-2016, 07:50 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by TimONeill View Post
My blog tracks hits back to the source. But you didn't answer my questions above. And what lack of "rigor"? I'm sorry, but I try to be as rigorous as possible and I don't take too kindly to people claiming otherwise. Please back up your accusation that I'm not rigorous.
In other words I was trying to write something that might elicit a response to see if you were watching. Don't read into it.

I have no interest in picking a fight with someone on the internet.

Why care if some yahoo on the internet claims anything about you?

Regarding "rigor": you think like a grad-degreed historian and you are in the fray with buffoons most of the time. Both contribute to a more-literal, less-literary set of instincts. "If you get the distinction" implies that I'm operating on a literary level. If you care (and again I don't see why you should), reread under the latter.

Or even on a literal level, "personally if I have to choose" with a smiley face means that not only was I disclosing my preferences rather than criticizing your writing, I was addressing only the case in which a tradeoff is compelled. In such a case one may personally be thoroughly rigorous while simplifying the writing to illustrate a point better.

As I recall the terminology comes from Weinberg's Intro to Systems Thinking, and he holds the same conviction I do. Having taught at Columbia, built software to put a man on the moon, and consulted at the higgest level, it would not necessarily be an insult to be compared to the man.

If you'd like me to give critical notes i can -- though you don't know me well enough to know how to weight them -- but basically it would boil down to "you're a history guy, not an exegete or theologian." And this should hardly be surprising.
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Unread 12-05-2016, 01:05 PM   #11
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If you'd like me to give critical notes i can -- though you don't know me well enough to know how to weight them -- but basically it would boil down to "you're a history guy, not an exegete or theologian." And this should hardly be surprising.
I suspect what it actually basically boils down to is that I don't accept the doctrines you believe and so you're telling yourself this is somehow because I'm "a history guy, not an exegete or theologian". I'm pretty clear on the relevant exegesis and theology thanks. You need to accept that there are many, many people who disagree with your religious ideas and that it may actually be you that's wrong.
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Unread 12-05-2016, 01:25 PM   #12
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Hey TimO'Neill, welcome to Christian Guitar Resources. I am posting to make you (and others) aware that this subforum, unlike other subforums, has additional requirements for posting, such as affirming the Athanasian and Nicene creeds. As is good forum etiquette, read the rules before posting http://www.christianguitar.org/forums/t134637/

To continue this particular discussion, please take this to a different forum. (Taylor, say, philosophy?)

P.S. I seriously don't want this conversation killed. It just doesn't belong right here.
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Unread 12-05-2016, 02:37 PM   #13
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Hey TimO'Neill, welcome to Christian Guitar Resources. I am posting to make you (and others) aware that this subforum, unlike other subforums, has additional requirements for posting, such as affirming the Athanasian and Nicene creeds. As is good forum etiquette, read the rules before posting http://www.christianguitar.org/forums/t134637/

To continue this particular discussion, please take this to a different forum. (Taylor, say, philosophy?)

P.S. I seriously don't want this conversation killed. It just doesn't belong right here.
To be fair, the Philosophy Sub-Forum was deleted a year or so ago when the decision was made to simplify the site.

I've started a thread in the Mod Sub-Forum, however, to discuss this and the (to my mind) outdated rules regarding faith claims and posting in the Theology Sub-Forum.
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Yes... I am the official "Knight Who Will Write Something On Derrida".
Bask in the wonderful glory.

"outside of a dog a book is a man's best friend... inside a dog it is too dark to read."
-groucho marx

Quote:
Originally Posted by Demon_Hunter View Post
Taylor, you just got drive-by theologied.
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Unread 12-05-2016, 06:49 PM   #14
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Per our discussion I'm okay suspending the application of the rules indefinitely with respect to this thread.
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Unread 12-05-2016, 06:50 PM   #15
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Carry on.
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