[tmlfan123]

Originally Posted by The Phantom Mullet

And only what, like 4 teams?

Eight.

[Dr. Worm]

Originally Posted by Art

To me, this is rich people vs. rich people. It sucks for us.

Regardless of anything, if the lockout happens, the fans are the only real losers.

The fans certainly lose. I think a case could be made that it also sucks for the thousands of "regular" people working for the league (non-players/coaches/etc.) that would not have a job this year.

Originally Posted by Art

Rookie Salary cap = YES.

Depends on where the money goes instead, really. Do veterans get paid more? Or do the owners just get paid more? Or do ticket prices go down?

Originally Posted by The Phantom Mullet

More injuries, shorter careers, more meaningless games, lower quality football due to less preseason, less exposure for non-superstar players during the preseason, and lastly..... changing the 'ruler' (so to speak) in the record books.

It lowers the quality of football for several reasons, really. More injuries means more backups playing. More snaps means more backups playing, with or without injuries.

I'm not a fan of when we change major parameters in sports. It changes the way we can measure things with records. Single season rushing record? Any single-season record, actually.

I doubt this would actually influence the single season rushing record at all, really. Running backs can only take so many carries in a season and continue to be effective. I don't think they'd be given more carries, I think you'd just see more and more committee backfields. Other records though, definitely. But as has been pointed out, do we think of the current records as meaningless because they happened in a 16 game season instead of the 14 game seasons we used to have?

[Art]

Originally Posted by Dr. Worm

Depends on where the money goes instead, really. Do veterans get paid more? Or do the owners just get paid more? Or do ticket prices go down?

Obviously I prefer that the savings are passed on to the fans, but the reality is that rookies should absolutely not be making as much as they do. At least the high picks.

[jthomas1600]

I agree with the two main points that have been made so far. A rookie salary cap would be a good thing. I've always felt bad for the player who has been in the league for a dozen years, worked his ass off, made like 15 mil and then a bunch of rookies are signing 20 million dollar contracts.

I don't like an 18 game season. Mostly because as much as I love football, I also like baseball, basketball, MMA, X-games, etc. etc. I just think the season is long enough.

On another note. I'm sick of all these athletes (basketball and baseball too) as well as the owners and coaches making so much money when they are basically working for us and we can't afford to pay them. I understand that especially in football a guys going to be pretty well wrecked by the end of his career, so I don't begrudge them making enough to retire on after playing for 12 years. But 25, 40, 60, 100 million? That just seems ridiculous to me. All that said to come to this point: I think we should have a fan lock out. As much as it hurts....ALL fans, don't watch any games, don't go to any games, don't buy any NFL, NBA, MLB products for 1 season. How would that be? Who's with me?

[Art]

I am definitely not with you. I enjoy the entertainment provided by sports, and I feel that I do not pay an unreasonable price for it. *shrug*

[jthomas1600]

Originally Posted by Art

I am definitely not with you. I enjoy the entertainment provided by sports, and I feel that I do not pay an unreasonable price for it. *shrug*

Well, I know you're a baseball fan and I'll concede that you can find some value there. I can go to an Astros game and get some pretty good seats with out breaking the bank. But have you tried to get good seats at an NBA game? I think it's crazy. And this bit about NFL TV kind of torques me off too. They're not making enough money from the adds on regular TV?

Honestly, it might have something to do with getting old. Maybe it has something to do with seeing retirement not too far off. I say this because I remember in my 20's knowing a few older guys that said they only watched college ball because they had no desire to see a bunch of millionaires running around.....

[Art]

I've been to an NBA playoff game. It was worth every dollar I spent on the seat.

I find the best value to be in the NHL.

Of course, here's the problem. NBA is closest to me (Sacramento Kings). Traveling to see a basketball game costs very little extra for me. Second closest (of the teams that I actually care to go see) is MLB (San Francisco Giants). Two hours of travel each way. Plus parking. Plus whatever else. NLF (49ers) is the same deal. And it is 3 hours each way for NHL (Sharks). Crazy.

[penguinofwar]

Originally Posted by Dr. Worm

Depends on where the money goes instead, really. Do veterans get paid more? Or do the owners just get paid more? Or do ticket prices go down?

It lowers the quality of football for several reasons, really. More injuries means more backups playing. More snaps means more backups playing, with or without injuries.

I just think that its absurd that they make what they do. I'm pretty sure when Matt Stafford signed his contract, he was like the 2 highest paid player in the NFL.

I feel like down the stretch there would be more meaningless games too.

Originally Posted by jthomas1600

I don't like an 18 game season. Mostly because as much as I love football, I also like baseball, basketball, MMA, X-games, etc. etc. I just think the season is long enough.

On another note. I'm sick of all these athletes (basketball and baseball too) as well as the owners and coaches making so much money when they are basically working for us and we can't afford to pay them. I understand that especially in football a guys going to be pretty well wrecked by the end of his career, so I don't begrudge them making enough to retire on after playing for 12 years. But 25, 40, 60, 100 million? That just seems ridiculous to me. All that said to come to this point: I think we should have a fan lock out. As much as it hurts....ALL fans, don't watch any games, don't go to any games, don't buy any NFL, NBA, MLB products for 1 season. How would that be? Who's with me?

I don't really see the MLB and NBA on the same level as the NFL as far as marketing and how much of a "business" it is, if that makes any sense. Anyway, I don't disagree with how we pay for so much, but as long as there is always a high demand to attend sporting events, prices are always going to be that high.

Originally Posted by Art

I've been to an NBA playoff game. It was worth every dollar I spent on the seat.

I find the best value to be in the NHL.

Of course, here's the problem. NBA is closest to me (Sacramento Kings). Traveling to see a basketball game costs very little extra for me. Second closest (of the teams that I actually care to go see) is MLB (San Francisco Giants). Two hours of travel each way. Plus parking. Plus whatever else. NLF (49ers) is the same deal. And it is 3 hours each way for NHL (Sharks). Crazy.

The Red Wings, Tigers, and Lions are all about 25 minutes from me, and Auburn Hills (the Pistons) are about 45 minutes. I guess I've got it pretty easy.. You do have access to like, a ton of teams though (are you close to Los Angeles?) but that might be the equivalent of me driving to Ohio to see some games.

[Art]

Originally Posted by penguinofwar

The Red Wings, Tigers, and Lions are all about 25 minutes from me, and Auburn Hills (the Pistons) are about 45 minutes. I guess I've got it pretty easy.. You do have access to like, a ton of teams though (are you close to Los Angeles?) but that might be the equivalent of me driving to Ohio to see some games.

Haha. Wrong end of the state. I am in the Sacramento Metropolitan area, which is about 400 miles from Los Angeles.

That said, yes, I do have fair access to a lot. I spent most of my life living another two hours from here. It is a small part of why I enjoy living here.

[tmlfan123]

Originally Posted by Art

I find the best value to be in the NHL.

If you live in California maybe...

[Art]

Originally Posted by tmlfan123

If you live in California maybe...

There are only a handful of NHL cities where you can't get a good deal on hockey tickets. The Sharks sell out all of their games, but their tickets are far from unreasonable. It stinks that it is not like that in Detroit, Toronto, Vancouver, etc.