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Unread 07-27-2010, 01:55 PM   #1
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the future of tab and reading music?

An essay I wrote for school.
A guy I know was talking about reading music one day, he says that he believes it is dying.
He only used guitar as an example because we all where playing guitar however, I assumed for the most part it would be the same with all other music correct?

At any rate, here is a rough thing of what he said.
Now days you have guitar programs that run tabs, tell you when to play and what not,
Yeah, people say they are wrong but that was because in till recently (last 20 so years)
it was new and "real musicians" did not use that, if you wanted to be a pro you had to read music no if ands or buts, and now that it is older they have pro tabers (guys who tab stuff out and are good at it, and yes I made that word up)

Now remember, music charts have been around for a long time, you had guys who where trained to write out stuff, thatís why it is so much better then tab, not because you paid for it but because there where people who are pros at doing it, there teachers did it and taught them, their teachers taught them, and so on and so on.

Now tab is doing that, you can go to sites and find bad tabs form that six year old want a be guitar hero kid, but you can also find the tab where this guy tells you everything you need to know.

Granted, you find those more in guitar programs then just plan tab, but thatís just like your more likely to find a good music chart if its in a book instead of someoneís room.

Itís like with horses centuryís ago, every one knew how to ride one, now everyone learns how to drive cars, and I think you agree that MOST people are better at driving cars then the first one which ran in to a wall on its first run.


As more people teach how to tab, people pick up form others, who pick up form others.

Now Iíve found a guitar pro site where I have searched over 5,000 songs and only 3 have been wrong

This site is something you can pay for (which is why I choice not to post a link)
But any one can update tabs; they can also upload the tab there and fix it then re-upload
It works and it can v be free if you donít want to slow down or what now
(But you could always upload it to your program and do that form there)

Anyways, my point and his I believe is that Tabs are not longer the bane of guitarists. People can tab with out making mistakes.
Of course like anything there will be those who are not good at it
(Like those who are not good at guitar)


But tab is no loner useless; it is very useful maybe even more so then reading music (at least for guitarists)
After all it takes a long time to learn to read music, yet reading tab is very easy and a lot more of them are being right then they are wrong.

And with tab you wonít always play the exact way the band dose which is a big plus for those who donít want to just play the same way the band dose


Of course he admits he dose not think it will ever disappear (or at least in our life times)
But tab is coming up

Like the horse which was taken over by the car
He thinks reading music will be taken over by tabs on guitar programs

After all just look at the guitar it self itís been becoming more and more technology as time goes on?
It seems logical that the way to read the music will do the same.



What do you guy think?

P.S this is a essay I did for school so the friend is fictional and this is my thoughts

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I honestly would have guessed the actual Kentl was mulletman and vice versa...
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Unread 07-27-2010, 02:10 PM   #2
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What do we think of the essay? Or the thesis/premise?

Something you have to consider is that guitar is not limited to rock bands or small worship ensembles. As a professional instrument standard notation will continue to be the norm because that is the common language of musicians. If I'm playing with an orchestra I need to know the language to effectively communicate with the other musicians, and I need to be able to understand what the conductor is telling me about my part. Knowing tab really well isn't going to help me there. It would be like being able to speak Russian really well and having a conversation with a group of people who only speak Chinese.

The other problem is that tab in and of itself doesn't tell you anything about the music. Tab might be convenient for some guitarists to quickly pick up a guitar part in the latest *insert favorite band here* song, but it doesn't tell you what that part is. It doesn't tell you the context meaning you're stuck playing what you have written there, but you don't gain the knowledge to branch out and make it your own.

Also, I don't think accuracy is the main drawback to tab. There are mistakes in standard notation too, just like there are typo's in many of your textbooks.

I think the problem with the premis is that you are assuming that easier = better. It's like stating that txt lingo will take over literature and no one will write full sentences in the future because it's quicker and easier to txt.
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Unread 07-27-2010, 02:20 PM   #3
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The 1 problem I have with this post is the norm was reading music, (as I said) but that is changing and I believe it might evenly be the other way around, not saying right now or in 20 years but one day. remember as technology gets better things get replaced, I see reading music getting replaced by pro tabs, 13 years ago you where a joke for using tabs and they where almost never good Now power tabs and guitar pro among others they use tab that tell you the timing and what not

another thing is remember language changes over time
Hence old English and what not
But just like horses I don’t think reading music will ever die

Just more people will use tab programs


I’m not saying easy = better but that is how society has always done it
And I don’t see reading music be deferent

and a guitar program tells you all you need to know
what to play at, like Forte and what not
gives you the dynamics
the temop gives you the speed

i dont see how it stops form working in a big band
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scared2mosh View Post
I honestly would have guessed the actual Kentl was mulletman and vice versa...
Quote:
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Apparently, he gave you persistence by the truckload.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TFK14 View Post
Ok, the fact you spelled that right proves it.
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Unread 07-27-2010, 02:23 PM   #4
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There are other instruments other than guitar. While standard notation is becoming less and less common for guitarists, it's not going anywhere for other instruments.
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Unread 07-27-2010, 02:26 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skeeter View Post
There are other instruments other than guitar. While standard notation is becoming less and less common for guitarists, it's not going anywhere for other instruments.
I know guitar programs that use other instruments, I donít see why you cant make a new form tab for those instruments, but then again i know close to noting about other instuments
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Quote:
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I honestly would have guessed the actual Kentl was mulletman and vice versa...
Quote:
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Apparently, he gave you persistence by the truckload.
Quote:
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Ok, the fact you spelled that right proves it.
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Unread 07-27-2010, 02:27 PM   #6
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Tab is not superior.

In fact, it sucks.

Here is why.

1) accuracy. Most tab is simply put, wrong.
2) timing. It doesn't have it. There is no distinction between a half note, quarter note, dotted eighth note or a whole note.
3) Allows people to memorize by rote without knowing what they are playing. Simply put, I have seen some very strange tabs of very simple things where someone had put it in a weird position on the fretboard.

As the norm becomes people not reading music, music will suffer. Because frankly, tab is only useful for recording what already exists. It has no compositional usage.

The fact is, 15 years ago tabs were a joke, and today most tabs are a joke. The system is flawed with only having one of the two major components of music, and it not well. It has pitch, but not timing. And it has a rigid pitch, rather than the notation which can be played in multiple locations.

Furthermore, tab has to be rewritten for alternate tunings.
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Unread 07-27-2010, 02:36 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillSPrestonEsq View Post
Tab is not superior.

In fact, it sucks.

Here is why.

1) accuracy. Most tab is simply put, wrong.
here is a link (do not pay for stuff it is NOT worht it Guitar Pro Tabs With Online Player | Songsterr
pick any band you like a more then 90% of songs you pick in your life time form there are corect or at least they sound right
Quote:
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2) timing. It doesn't have it. There is no distinction between a half note, quarter note, dotted eighth note or a whole note.
if you look it dose tell you and even if you dont know hwo to tell just play the song form the program


As the norm becomes people not reading music, music will suffer. Because frankly, tab is only useful for recording what already exists. It has no compositional usage.
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Originally Posted by BillSPrestonEsq View Post
The fact is, 15 years ago tabs were a joke, and today most tabs are a joke. The system is flawed with only having one of the two major components of music, and it not well. It has pitch, but not timing. And it has a rigid pitch, rather than the notation which can be played in multiple locations.
if you know music theroy you know that the
thid freat low E is also in the third sting open

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillSPrestonEsq View Post
Furthermore, tab has to be rewritten for alternate tunings.
I've seen prgrams will it transponse it for you (very well to)

i said Guiar prgorams
like guitar pro
power tabs and tuxguitar
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Quote:
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I honestly would have guessed the actual Kentl was mulletman and vice versa...
Quote:
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Apparently, he gave you persistence by the truckload.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TFK14 View Post
Ok, the fact you spelled that right proves it.
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Unread 07-27-2010, 03:17 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kentl View Post
here is a link (do not pay for stuff it is NOT worht it Guitar Pro Tabs With Online Player | Songsterr
pick any band you like a more then 90% of songs you pick in your life time form there are corect or at least they sound right

power tabs and tuxguitar

dude, i never saw this website, it's pretty cool... i think i will use it.
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Unread 07-27-2010, 04:00 PM   #9
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The thing with those tab program is they actually have the standard notation, too. Otherwise the tab is unreadable.

For argument's sake, let's say tab is the future for guitar. How are we going to tell what the rhythm is? How are we going to be able to easily visualise the contour of the melody?

While standard notation is not the norm for many guitarists, it still has its place. For instance, if a band is recording a studio album and they need a fill in guitarist for whatever reason. They can't hand him/her a sheet with numbers and lines and expect him/her to know how to play that. However, if they hand him/her a sheet with standard notation (and possibly tab) he/she would know exactly how to play that.

While it may not be used commonly, standard notation is a necessity. There is only so far you can get by text.
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Unread 07-27-2010, 04:04 PM   #10
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But in order for tab to be useful with all that transposing and timing stuff, it needs the program. If somebody handed you a sheet of paper with a tab on it and told you to play it, you'd be in the dark without the program. But if somebody handed you proper sheet music, after maybe a minute or two reviewing it, you'd be able to play it (if you were competent at reading sheet music that is, which I am not yet). Point is, sheet music doesn't need the program.
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Unread 07-27-2010, 04:06 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giga Hertz View Post
The thing with those tab program is they actually have the standard notation, too. Otherwise the tab is unreadable.

For argument's sake, let's say tab is the future for guitar. How are we going to tell what the rhythm is? How are we going to be able to easily visualise the contour of the melody?

While standard notation is not the norm for many guitarists, it still has its place. For instance, if a band is recording a studio album and they need a fill in guitarist for whatever reason. They can't hand him/her a sheet with numbers and lines and expect him/her to know how to play that. However, if they hand him/her a sheet with standard notation (and possibly tab) he/she would know exactly how to play that.

While it may not be used commonly, standard notation is a necessity. There is only so far you can get by text.
Did you look at songster?
It dose not it has lines that tell you
And tux guitar has some versions that dose that and if I remember guitar pro Can be set to it

you dont need to know the quater notes they ahve a way

the lines tell you if its a half note or what
nothing with reading music
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I honestly would have guessed the actual Kentl was mulletman and vice versa...
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Apparently, he gave you persistence by the truckload.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TFK14 View Post
Ok, the fact you spelled that right proves it.
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Unread 07-27-2010, 04:10 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kentl View Post
Did you look at songster?
It dose not it has lines that tell you
And tux guitar has some versions that dose that and if I remember guitar pro Can be set to it

you dont need to know the quater notes they ahve a way

the lines tell you if its a half note or what
nothing with reading music
Okay, fine. Standard notation dies. How do the programmers know how to convert tab to standard notation?

There has to be some sort of graphical notation. If standard notation dies, there won't be graphical notation.
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Unread 07-27-2010, 04:11 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ethan.Bassist. View Post
But in order for tab to be useful with all that transposing and timing stuff, it needs the program. If somebody handed you a sheet of paper with a tab on it and told you to play it, you'd be in the dark without the program. But if somebody handed you proper sheet music, after maybe a minute or two reviewing it, you'd be able to play it (if you were competent at reading sheet music that is, which I am not yet). Point is, sheet music doesn't need the program.
how long before they ahve a guitar program that you can take with you (they alredy ahve it on the iphone and what not)
plus most bands i see have a laptop with them at gigs
and a lot of msuusions get their music sheets off the internet
so i really dont see your point

rember i said 20+ years

and no i dont know any one who is skilled enough to play a pice within a miunit or two of looking at it (unless its simple and evrey one knows it)

reading music takes a lot og times
plius the prgrams are often free

sheet music needs a long time of learning

and if someone gave me a msuic sheet i would be in the dark becuse i've only been studying it for only 5 months


whats to stop someone having a cell phone (since almost evrey one has one now and imagin in 20+ years) and ahving the rpgoram with you?
where evr you go its there


they both have their cons and pros

music sheets ahve more cons

Quote:
Originally Posted by Giga Hertz View Post
Okay, fine. Standard notation dies. How do the programmers know how to convert tab to standard notation?

There has to be some sort of graphical notation. If standard notation dies, there won't be graphical notation.
it dose it

in setings

you can choice to use both or one or the aother


im not sure what you mean by there wont be

all i know is if you load songster to anything you can change it to stand notation eazy
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I honestly would have guessed the actual Kentl was mulletman and vice versa...
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Apparently, he gave you persistence by the truckload.
Quote:
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Ok, the fact you spelled that right proves it.
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Unread 07-27-2010, 04:16 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kentl View Post
it dose it

in setings

you can choice to use both or one or the aother


im not sure what you mean by there wont be

all i know is if you load songster to anything you can change it to stand notation eazy
You're getting confused. My point was if standard notation is dead, the programmers won't know how to graphically display the music. Think about this. If all the engineers died and so did all car engines, and nobody else knew, how would you make that car go?

Standard notation, is one of the only viable (and in fact, easiest) methods of conveying rhyhtm and melody.

Quote:
they both have their cons and pros

music sheets ahve more cons
Only if you can't read standard notation. In all honesty, I can barely read it off the fly, and in all honesty, I'll have to stare at an entire line for a few moments and read each individual note to understand. But I would much rather be able to look at a sheet and see the rhythm instantly, than have to flail about on a tab until I find something that works.

Don't get me wrong, in many instances tab is a lot easier to read. But unless you already know the song, it's no good.
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Unread 07-27-2010, 04:18 PM   #15
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The biggest limitation I've seen with tab isn't rhythm (I've seen rhythmic tabs) it's that it's not easily wielded. Maybe it's just the songster site, but it looks like the tab for a 4 minute song would be pages and pages of tab. No thanks...

I think Skeeter's point is what kills tab as a mainstream replacement for standard notation as well. If I'm a multi-instrumentalist (and a good one) I can take a piece of music in standard notation and play it on guitar, piano, saxophone, zither, whatever. I can't do that with a tab, because tabs are guitar specific. The programs I've seen have taken other instrument parts and said, "this is how you would play it on guitar". Doing the opposite ("here's how to play a guitar part on saxophone") isn't simple...plus all the saxophone players just want to see it in standard notation.
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