[penguinofwar]

Originally Posted by Ax

I don't think I can believe anything ESPN says right now as James' father is an ESPN commentator.

I've read up on this quite a bit and I think that James is nothing but a whiny ☺☺☺☺☺. I don't know if Leach is above reproach or not, but James had a concussion and the "shed" he was put in was more like a garage where he had water and a fan. He was "forced" to relax. Then when he was put in the "electrical closet" he was put in a room where they film post game interviews with coaches because he showed up to practice with sunglasses on saying he couldn't practice. That coupled with James' overall poor attitude and sense of deserving because of his father, tends to point the blame towards James.

Originally Posted by bravesfan007

This is what I've found throughout all of my reading on the matter. Apparently James is just a decent player who was given a shot by Leach, but after not getting enough playing time because of his name he decides to bring Leach down. Immaturity if you ask me.

My thoughts on the whole situation. Leach may have done something wrong and probably could have handled the situation better, but with the so-called integrity of Adam James I find it hard to believe that this whole thing was just a successful attempt to take down Leach. It seems like James was just trying to take down Leach as a way of getting back for his lack of PT over the years (exactly what bravesfan said).

[TunerSteve]

I really don't know all that much about the Texas Tech situation, but having a similar situation with Mark Mangino at Kansas (where he was accused of mistreating players) I would have to suspect there was more than just one situation that led the school to take the action they took. I would tend to think he was fired after bringing a lawsuit against his employer. During the investigation of Mark Mangino I was originally supportive of Mangino, but as more and more stories came out, it was inevitable that his tactics were abusive and warrented his parting ways with KU. Not saying this is the case with Leach, but I would think the school would fire him as a last resort. Once these allegations are made against a coach, it's very very difficult for them to recruit, when other schools are constantly repeating the allegations to prospective recruits.

[Jonular]

Originally Posted by S.B.Nichols

EDIT: I'm not sure how this post got me negative feedback, but OK. Apparently it's child-like.

Haha don't worry about it...some people are apparently pretty volatile when it comes to college football. You aren't the first.

At the surface, given the contention between player and coach, it can seem like such a grey issue, with no clear wrongdoer. But given the player's reputation, how he got on the team (his dad called the Mike Leach and sent a video), and the previously existing contention between school administration and the coach, it does look like the school was looking for something to fire the coach over.

Texas Tech's football program has reaped huge benefits from what Mike Leach has done, and subsequently, so has the school. If it weren't for the dad's position at ESPN (which any booster or chancellor is going to be scared of), I'm not sure this story would have gotten anymore attention than any other typical NCAA violation type story. But between the school and ESPN, it seems like they quickly turned the attention into an anti-Leach campaign. Was their really time for due process of an investigation?

[Fandrew]

It still bothesr me that when the Mangino allegations came out, people didn't believe them until other former players came out with stories. We haven't seen that happen yet at Texas Tech. I really think Tech was just looking for an excuse to not pay him that bonus.

[Gwenny]

Originally Posted by JayCarrFan

It still bothesr me that when the Mangino allegations came out, people didn't believe them until other former players came out with stories. We haven't seen that happen yet at Texas Tech. I really think Tech was just looking for an excuse to not pay him that bonus.

Actually, Adam James does have the support of most of the current players right now. I still think it is ridiculous to keep bashing someone, if you

A. Don't have all the facts about what really happened
B. Don't actually know the coach or the player personally
C. Are a homer and fail to realize that a coach does not make a team. The players make the team what it is in college football.

I think it is really stupid to blame a coaches firing on one player. James clearly felt that he was treated badly, current players agree, and I still don't buy for one minute that Leach was only fired over money. Leach knew who Adam's father was, and still chose to deal with him in that way. I think Leach is as much to blame here, as anyone else. And it doesn't matter anyway. Since Leach is gone from Texas Tech. He can go on to some other school and coach there. Hopefully he'll learn not to mess with the player's whose father is famous. That way we don't have to hear anymore ridiculous arguments that kids of famous fathers are lazy, even when he does have the support of his own team.

[bravesfan007]

Originally Posted by luvinjesus

Actually, Adam James does have the support of most of the current players right now.

Gwen, you've failed to show any evidence supporting this claim.

Originally Posted by luvinjesus

I still think it is ridiculous to keep bashing someone, if you

A. Don't have all the facts about what really happened.

Did the administration really have time to complete a thorough investigation? It seems as if they went at it pretty hastily and were quick to fire him.

Originally Posted by luvinjesus

Leach knew who Adam's father was, and still chose to deal with him in that way. I think Leach is as much to blame here, as anyone else. And it doesn't matter anyway. Since Leach is gone from Texas Tech. He can go on to some other school and coach there. Hopefully he'll learn not to mess with the player's whose father is famous. That way we don't have to hear anymore ridiculous arguments that kids of famous fathers are lazy, even when he does have the support of his own team.

Are you saying that because his dad is famous he shouldn't have been punished? As far as I'm concerned Leach treated him fairly and without respect to who his father was. Do we want special treatment for those athletes whose parents are famous?

[penguinofwar]

Interesting story here:

The other day my parents were shopping for a new stove (cause our current one is broken) and when they were at home depot they met one of the salesmen there. My parents got into a conversation with him and the salesmen told my parents about how his name was Kevin Smith and said he played tailback for Ohio state about 30 years ago (he later played in the NFL for a couple of years). He talked about how he was on OSU when Woody Hayes (who was somewhat of a nut if you did not know) coached there and he stood right next to Woody Hayes during the infamous incident where Woody Hayes punched a player on Clemson near the end of their bowl game. According to this guy, Kevin Smith, who had been standing next to Woody practically the entire game, said the play before that the player who Woody punched had purposely ran over to the sidelines and knocked Woody over. So the play after that, this same guy on Clemson got a pick and (according to Kevin) had came over to do the same thing, and so Woody clocked him. Immediately the media came over and told on the players on the OSU sideline not to say anything about how this player had bumped into Woody and it was all Woody if anybody had asked. The message in the media was that Woody had just taken this cheap shot at this guy for no reason other than being upset about losing.




In essence, my point of the story isn't to justify what Woody did or anything of that sort. My point is to say how the media likes to point out the "bad guy" and exaggerate and exploit the things that they did for whatever reason. The media likes to point out one side of the story and make it a lot worse than it actually is. So this whole story came to mind relating to Mike Leach..

[Gwenny]

Originally Posted by penguinofwar

Interesting story here:

The other day my parents were shopping for a new stove (cause our current one is broken) and when they were at home depot they met one of the salesmen there. My parents got into a conversation with him and the salesmen told my parents about how his name was Kevin Smith and said he played tailback for Ohio state about 30 years ago (he later played in the NFL for a couple of years). He talked about how he was on OSU when Woody Hayes (who was somewhat of a nut if you did not know) coached there and he stood right next to Woody Hayes during the infamous incident where Woody Hayes punched a player on Clemson near the end of their bowl game. According to this guy, Kevin Smith, who had been standing next to Woody practically the entire game, said the play before that the player who Woody punched had purposely ran over to the sidelines and knocked Woody over. So the play after that, this same guy on Clemson got a pick and (according to Kevin) had came over to do the same thing, and so Woody clocked him. Immediately the media came over and told on the players on the OSU sideline not to say anything about how this player had bumped into Woody and it was all Woody if anybody had asked. The message in the media was that Woody had just taken this cheap shot at this guy for no reason other than being upset about losing.




In essence, my point of the story isn't to justify what Woody did or anything of that sort. My point is to say how the media likes to point out the "bad guy" and exaggerate and exploit the things that they did for whatever reason. The media likes to point out one side of the story and make it a lot worse than it actually is. So this whole story came to mind relating to Mike Leach..

Any Ohio State fan could have told you that. But Woody Hayes had the tendency to punch some of his players in practice. He definitely wouldn't get away with that style of coaching today.

I also think that media is vilifying Adam James in this situation over Leach. But again, this is a moot point and story as Leach is no longer the coach of the Texas Tech football team.

[Fandrew]

I still think it's safe to say that Mike Leach will coach again.

[Jonular]

Originally Posted by luvinjesus

I also think that media is vilifying Adam James in this situation over Leach. But again, this is a moot point and story as Leach is no longer the coach of the Texas Tech football team.

He is the reason why Mike Leach, a very (relatively) successful coach for Texas Tech for the last ten years, was fired. To not expect some negative media attention, particularly given his father's role, is just as absurd as the notion that coaches are supporting Coach Leach to "cover their own rear ends".

I could make ridiculous hypothetical suggestions that would hold just as much weight as your hypotheticals. I think we can agree that ultimately, Mike didn't have to be fired, in two ways. First, the school didn't have to fire him so quickly. Second, apparently he was given the chance to apologize and all would be well (correct me if I'm wrong on this).

And Leach felt that wasn't necessary, and I suppose it comes down to a matter of pride and stubbornness. I don't feel like any of us can actually say whether that was appropriate or not.