San Diego Couple is told to cease bible study group in their home

Big_al · 05-30-2009, 02:47 AM

http://www.10news.com/news/19562217/detail.html

bowstaff981 · 05-30-2009, 08:35 AM

This disgusts me.

TunerSteve · 05-30-2009, 08:47 AM

California...it's like a whole other country!

The line of questioning sure makes it a constitutional issue and I would think that the government coffers (which are already suffering) could lose a bunch more if this group decides to sue.

**slap_j** · 05-30-2009, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TunerSteve

The line of questioning sure makes it a constitutional issue

Freedom of religion is considered a fundamental right in the US. It won't bode well for the county if that's actually the motivation in shutting this group down. Although one could interpret those questions in another way. Maybe they were just trying to suss out exactly what was going on there so they could determine if a permit for religious assembly would be a legitimate thing to force them to acquire. I suppose if they don't carpool and there are a dozen cars clogging up the street on a weekly basis it would make more sense. Anyway, seems fishy to me but unfortunately we don't have all the facts.

TunerSteve · 05-30-2009, 09:02 AM

I guess that's a point I'm not clear on. If it's a parking issue, what does it matter if the gathering is for a bible study, or a group that gathers each monday night to watch Monday Night Football? I mean, if cars are parked illegally, they should obviously be ticketed. Are there laws specifically aimed at religious gatherings? I can certainly understand getting some use permit for holding a tent revival, expecting hundreds to show up, but 15 people seems awfully low to require a special use permit.

Like you stated, we don't have all the facts. I suspect we haven't heard the end of this story either.

Napoleon17 · 05-30-2009, 10:00 AM

The way the story is written, it sounds like a disturbing case, to say the least. I'm not sure I buy this story, though.

Jay Tea · 05-30-2009, 10:13 AM

"Maybe they were just trying to suss out exactly what was going on there so they could determine if a permit for religious assembly would be a legitimate thing to force them to acquire."

The original link has a video link with the county's response. Which says basically exactly this.

Internet Monk has some good thoughts as well: http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/...iego#more-3284

**Ridley's Own** · 05-30-2009, 10:44 AM

Hmm.

Lots of things I want to know more about. Like what the zoning statute says about religious gatherings, and at what point a small group becomes a "gathering" and such. Did the neighbors complain? The zoning ordinance would seem to be religiously neutral (would a 15-person group of atheists or secularists fall under a similar ordinance?), so I have some pretty serious doubts this is what the right-wing press is making it out to be.

If the statute is clear, and they're in violation of it, then I ☺☺☺☺ to see the problem with being cited.

EDIT: Bizarrely, my browser keeps rendering "f-ail" in the above sentance as four smiley faces. I dunno.

Kentl · 05-30-2009, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ridley's Own

EDIT: Bizarrely, my browser keeps rendering "f-ail" in the above sentance as four smiley faces. I dunno.

bill did that

**thesteve** · 05-30-2009, 11:25 AM

There's a lot of speculation from people within the county that are saying that San Diego County, along with the rest of the state, is broke, and looking for ways to potentially make a quick buck.

It sounds like from the video that at least the one neighbor that was interviewed doesn't really care about the meetings. I think that the money issue only comes up because the county might be able to call a Bible study a "religious assembly" and get some money out of it. In the case of other types of meetings held in homes (16-20 weeks of football games during the season, poker nights, etc.) there isn't any type of licensing that can be pushed on those people, so all the zoning board can do is tell the people to stop meeting with no response of, "but if you want to keep meeting, it will cost you X dollars".

Ridley,
The person who complained wasn't a neighbor, but was a guest of one of the neighbors who claims that one of the study attenders hit his car when they were leaving and didn't stop to leave a note.

Ax · 05-30-2009, 11:36 AM

Why is f a i l censored? ☺☺☺☺ ☺☺☺☺ ☺☺☺☺

**thesteve** · 05-30-2009, 11:42 AM

f ail is censored along with the word e pic because there was so much abuse of the two terms in CPF.

it really makes the rest of CGR a bit frustrating though, doesn't it?

JerryLove · 05-30-2009, 11:56 AM

As written that looks like a pretty extreme and unlawful interference.

But it's what's not there I'd like to know. What is the rule that is being broken? Is that rule enforced with reasonable consistency? How was this even brought to the attention of the law in the first place?

IOW: Had this been the "weekly movie night" with the same crowd, would they similarly have had trouble.

If the crux of the problem is religion, there's something very wrong with the law. If, on the other hand, there are rules against regular gatherings of (say) more than 15 cars in a residential neighborhood, then (though I may not agree its a good law) it's not nearly the scenario implied in the article.

**thesteve** · 05-30-2009, 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JerryLove

If the crux of the problem is religion, there's something very wrong with the law. If, on the other hand, there are rules against regular gatherings of (say) more than 15 cars in a residential neighborhood, then (though I may not agree its a good law) it's not nearly the scenario implied in the article.

If there is a law against such gatherings, I definitely feel comfortable saying that it is not being enforced with any consistency in San Diego County.

doulos14 · 05-31-2009, 05:55 PM

There are rights that say you can practice your own religion and assemble peacefully, correct?

Then what does the city think it's doing.