[nolidad]

Bribing lawmakers isn't illegal.

http://www.ktuu.com/Global/story.asp?s=6480399
http://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/20...maker-indicted
http://resources.bnet.com/topic/brib...eadership.html #2&3

these indictments says differently.

According to the Center for Responsive Politics, [ADM]'s political action committee and employees have made more than $2.1 million in federal campaign contributions since 2001, with 63 percent of that total going to Republican candidates. - http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news0...t_ethanol.html

How dumb are the ethanol guys--the repubs are the drill here drill now guys- they are more for using the untapped billionso fbbls of oil than creatin ethanol plants generally speaking.

Not all. Some are supporting a candidate that already has their interests at heart. Most however, yes.

Then yor mind is set and talking about industry bribing govt. is moot.

You question rather answers itself. It's common sense that certainly in the history of the country someone has been bribed (given money to vote one way or another). Do you really think it's never happened ever at any point?

Whether it has happened wasn't at issue but its legality and i have shown it is illegal to bribe federal officials.

Heres some more showing it illegal to bribe federal officials:

http://www.answers.com/topic/political-corruption
http://llr.lls.edu/volumes/v33-issue4/levin.pdf

As to the uselessness of the ethanol industry we are in agreement-- it does not serve the public good and should be stored next to eh edsel

[JerryLove]

Originally Posted by nolidad

http://www.ktuu.com/Global/story.asp?s=6480399
http://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/20...maker-indicted
http://resources.bnet.com/topic/brib...eadership.html #2&3

these indictments says differently.

I welcome you to the hypocrisy that is government. PAC, SIG, and individual corporations give billions to their favorite policy-makers every year. They give them exactly the cushy jobs being discussed (do you think Cheney sat on the board of Auther-Anderson and Haliburton because of his good looks?).

I've worked for more than one company with a list of which politicians would do their bidding and were being paid for it.

How dumb are the ethanol guys--the repubs are the drill here drill now guys- they are more for using the untapped billionso fbbls of oil than creatin ethanol plants generally speaking.

I see you are campaigning again.

I'll pretend, for the sake of argument that there's an unlimited supply of oil readily accessible just below the gulf where there's a rig all ready to pull it and a brand-new refinery to process it. None of that is true of course, but we'll pretend it is. Gas is still 10% ethanol by federal regulation.

Not that the oil companies aren't profiting from ethanol (http://renergie.wordpress.com/2009/0...oil-companies/)

How about you? Why do *you* think there is a national law *requiring* the inclusion of ethanol in gasoline?

Then yor mind is set and talking about industry bribing govt. is moot.

Much like my mind is set that the sun )proverbially) rises.. yes.

Whether it has happened wasn't at issue but its legality and i have shown it is illegal to bribe federal officials.

Name the ex-president worth less than $50,000,000.

As to the uselessness of the ethanol industry we are in agreement-- it does not serve the public good and should be stored next to eh edsel

Picking on the Edsel? Tsk. Tsk.

[nolidad]

I see you are campaigning again.

I didn't know I was running for office. I have lots of catching up to do then.

How about you? Why do *you* think there is a national law *requiring* the inclusion of ethanol in gasoline?

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

I welcome you to the hypocrisy that is government. PAC, SIG, and individual corporations give billions to their favorite policy-makers every year. They give them exactly the cushy jobs being discussed (do you think Cheney sat on the board of Auther-Anderson and Haliburton because of his good looks?).

Ah Yes. but our noble politicians who never think of their oen self interests determined to legalize these things so that corps. would not be indicted for attempting to bribe political officials.

[JerryLove]

Originally Posted by nolidad

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Exactly. And who would need to receive said money in order to get the votes passed... the politicians.

Ah Yes. but our noble politicians who never think of their oen self interests determined to legalize these things so that corps. would not be indicted for attempting to bribe political officials.

Aren't we lucky to be surrounded by such nobility?

[nolidad]

Originally Posted by JerryLove

Exactly. And who would need to receive said money in order to get the votes passed... the politicians.

Aren't we lucky to be surrounded by such nobility?

We are lucky--it doth takes one breath away. The only difference sometimes between the parties is just simply the number opf people pouring money into their coffers.

[Playn4God]

Jerry, I think this is a great article you posted, I have always thought that ethanol was a terrible energy substitute from the start (and owning a BMW with a high pressure fuel pump, I have seen many other owners speculate that the failure of their high pressure fuel pump to be related to ethanol). I'd rather see diesel used as a substitute (visit Europe, and you will see how they have those engines down to a science!). The diesel Jetta we already have is a great testament to the engine's simplicity and superior fuel efficiency as well. I like what some companies like Tesla are doing with their research and marketing of electric cars, and I wouldn't hate it if people started using them as their daily drivers if we can perfect them (doesn't necessarily reduce pollution a ton as from what I know it just shifts it, but it's CHEAP). However, as a die hard car enthusiast, you will have to pry MY internal-combustion engine out of my dead hands .

[redbaron]

It's terrific for racing, for what it's worth, and I guarantee you that it pollutes less than high octane leaded fuels.

be that as it may, it's not a great solution because in order for ethanol to be efficient you need a tune that is spot on, and if the car is flex fueled it has to run on e85 or gas, or any mix of the two, which means that they default to pig rich and waste tons of energy that way too.

[JerryLove]

Originally Posted by redbaron

It's terrific for racing, for what it's worth, and I guarantee you that it pollutes less than high octane leaded fuels.

be that as it may, it's not a great solution because in order for ethanol to be efficient you need a tune that is spot on, and if the car is flex fueled it has to run on e85 or gas, or any mix of the two, which means that they default to pig rich and waste tons of energy that way too.

It has less energy per volume, it's corrosive, there's a lot of pollution in making it, and no one uses leaded fuels any more.

[scared2mosh]

I thought it was a bad idea from the beginning... "Flex Fuel" enginges are already proving that they dont last nearly as long. If you as me the real solution would be something like clean deisel.

Good article IMO

Hybrid vs. diesel vs. flex-fuel - Hybrid (1) - CNNMoney.com