[athanatos]

Originally Posted by Demon_Hunter

We are all members of one body, and we need each other.

The body is interdependent on its parts. My brain cant act as hands, nor can my brain pump blood to the rest of my body, my heart cant oxygenate the blood it pumps, nor can it filter out CO2 from my system, my hands cant think for me, and they cant pump blood.

Thats why humans have multiple parts that perform different tasks necessary for the body as a whole.

As the church we are one unit, and without one another we are incomplete, and less efficient and lesser equiped for our mission when our parts are either not functioning as one unit, or are missing all together.

If the point is communication, why is being cryptic acceptable? See Gay Science, book 3 §173.

[Dr. Thrunk]

Gay Science?

[slap_j]

Originally Posted by Thrash

Gay Science?

"Die fröhliche Wissenschaft" - Nietzsche.

[Demon_Hunter]

Originally Posted by athanatos

If the point is communication, why is being cryptic acceptable? See Gay Science, book 3 §173.

I dont think I have that book on hand...

Mind quoting it for me?

[balaamsass]

The welcome mat says I should go somewhere else, creeds and all sorry

[Folk_guy]

Being involved with a church body is definately a good thing, and helps me in my faith journey, but I know from first hand experience that it isn't mandatory. My Grandfather who had to retire early because of complications with diabetis never went to church, but read his Bible and prayed daily, and I'm sure wasn't destined to go to hell because he didn't participate in or belong to a larger church body. I'm not saying that being part of a church wouldn't have strenghtend his faith, or made him a stronger follower of Christ, but I am saying that his lack of church going didn't condemn him to eternal damnation.

[athanatos]

Originally Posted by Demon_Hunter

I dont think I have that book on hand...

Mind quoting it for me?

http://www.bilkent.edu.tr/~thurston/nietzsche.pdf
§173
Being profound and seeming profound.— Those who know that they are
profound strive for clarity; those who would like to seem profound to the
crowd strive for obscurity. For the crowd believes that if it cannot see to
the bottom of something it must be profound: it is so timid and dislikes
going into the water.

[slap_j]

Originally Posted by athanatos

http://www.bilkent.edu.tr/~thurston/nietzsche.pdf
§173
Being profound and seeming profound.— Those who know that they are
profound strive for clarity; those who would like to seem profound to the
crowd strive for obscurity. For the crowd believes that if it cannot see to
the bottom of something it must be profound: it is so timid and dislikes
going into the water.

Guess that's why people ***** about Derrida.

[Dr. Thrunk]

Originally Posted by Folk_guy

Being involved with a church body is definately a good thing, and helps me in my faith journey, but I know from first hand experience that it isn't mandatory. My Grandfather who had to retire early because of complications with diabetis never went to church, but read his Bible and prayed daily, and I'm sure wasn't destined to go to hell because he didn't participate in or belong to a larger church body. I'm not saying that being part of a church wouldn't have strenghtend his faith, or made him a stronger follower of Christ, but I am saying that his lack of church going didn't condemn him to eternal damnation.

Does someone who never followed out in baptism go to hell if they "accepted Christ"? No, but they disobeyed a commandment from Christ.
Though many "Christians" may not go to church, they are still neglecting a vital part of being a Christian.

Name a follower of Christ who did not participate in a church like community in the NT, or even in early Christian history. I don't think you could name many.
I think being a Christian carries with it an almost mandatory call to regularly interact with other believers. Neglecting this is neglecting an essential part of Christ-likeness. I think your grandfather may have missed out on a lot of things, as do all believers who neglect partaking in community.

[Demon_Hunter]

Originally Posted by athanatos

http://www.bilkent.edu.tr/~thurston/nietzsche.pdf
§173
Being profound and seeming profound.— Those who know that they are
profound strive for clarity; those who would like to seem profound to the
crowd strive for obscurity. For the crowd believes that if it cannot see to
the bottom of something it must be profound: it is so timid and dislikes
going into the water.

Im guess the author then believes that Jesus was only seeming to be profound?

Afterall, it is written by atleast 2 of the gospel writers (John for sure, and I think Matthew and Luke both mention it) that "he taught them with parables, and without a parable he did not teach them that 'Hearing they may not hear, and seeing they may not understand" (or some such thing)."

This is in no way relevant to the thread, but its still interesting to look at.

*edit*

I should clarify.

I dislike vaguery (a few times going through the different gospels I find myself going "Dude, just say what you mean!" when Im reading some of Jesus more... obscured parables.

At the same time... I dont know. I think some of the object lessons he taught wouldnt have had near the power they did without the parables he used. Mostly because he got the Pharisees to condemn themselves with their own responses to the parables.

_________________

To go along with what Thrash said, looking at the NT its difficult to find an example of a strong believer, whose faith and endurance in the way are recognized, who did not actively fellowship with other believers or participate in a gathering of some kind.

You may not go to hell for it, but you definately are missing out on what appears to be a major blessing.

[athanatos]

Originally Posted by Demon_Hunter

Im guess the author then believes that Jesus was only seeming to be profound?

Heh, ironically I don't think he felt that way about Jesus. Nietzsche had some odd/interesting ideas about power and confidence (Jesus being a good example), and about morality (I guess another good example). But I really wouldn't know: It's Nietzsche after all.

Afterall, it is written by atleast 2 of the gospel writers (John for sure, and I think Matthew and Luke both mention it) that "he taught them with parables, and without a parable he did not teach them that 'Hearing they may not hear, and seeing they may not understand" (or some such thing)."

That's true; Had I lived in the time of Christ (yet somehow still maintaining my worldview and understanding) I might have been frustrated with Jesus, to be honest.

*edit*

I should clarify.

I dislike vaguery (a few times going through the different gospels I find myself going "Dude, just say what you mean!" when Im reading some of Jesus more... obscured parables.

At the same time... I dont know. I think some of the object lessons he taught wouldnt have had near the power they did without the parables he used. Mostly because he got the Pharisees to condemn themselves with their own responses to the parables.

I think Jesus had a point to his speaking in parables: it requires only those who are interested to dig deeper. People can reject things just as easily as they understand it; and are slow to reject something just as slowly as they understand it. (though not necessarily the case: people reject things they don't understand often)

[Folk_guy]

Originally Posted by Thrash

Does someone who never followed out in baptism go to hell if they "accepted Christ"? No, but they disobeyed a commandment from Christ.
Though many "Christians" may not go to church, they are still neglecting a vital part of being a Christian.

Name a follower of Christ who did not participate in a church like community in the NT, or even in early Christian history. I don't think you could name many.
I think being a Christian carries with it an almost mandatory call to regularly interact with other believers. Neglecting this is neglecting an essential part of Christ-likeness. I think your grandfather may have missed out on a lot of things, as do all believers who neglect partaking in community.

I'm not saying that Church going, and interacting with other Chirstions isn't an important part of our faith journey, I also agree that by not participating with other Christians in worship we are neglecting a directive from Christ. I would encourage any believer to become an active part of a Church body. All I'm saying is that I don't think it's necessary for salvation. In the case of my Grandfather who was very much a shut in. Going to Church for him, would have been very difficult for him.

[King Edward]

Yo Thrash, Remember the thief or killer, whatever he was, that was on the cross next to Christ? I mean the one who realized and Believed in Christ? Jesus told him, "Today you will be with me in heaven" !! This guy never got baptized! I know God wants us to die to self and rise again as a new creature which is the ultimate reasoning for baptism. This is what you should do, in submission if you get the chance. Thats my thoughts, peace out

[Demon_Hunter]

Taylor, you just got drive-by theologied.

[Dr. Thrunk]

Originally Posted by King Edward

Yo Thrash, Remember the thief or killer, whatever he was, that was on the cross next to Christ? I mean the one who realized and Believed in Christ? Jesus told him, "Today you will be with me in heaven" !! This guy never got baptized! I know God wants us to die to self and rise again as a new creature which is the ultimate reasoning for baptism. This is what you should do, in submission if you get the chance. Thats my thoughts, peace out

Wassup bro! Yeah, I hear ya, but the thief did not get the chance did he? He was on a cross. He wasn;t able to obey that particular command.

Furthermore, I believe Christ told the disciples to go out and baptize in his name AFTER this particular theif was dead and after he himself had arisen as the firstfruits.