[jengoesup]

How does one come to a conclusion on the correct religion? In a sense that's a ridiculous question, because if it were obvious which one it were everybody would be united under one banner. It just seems as if every person in every faith has experienced some part of God. I don't feel that God would let these people experience Himself if He just planned on damning them later. As Jesus says in Matthew 7:

9 Which of you, if his son asks for bread, will live him a stone? 10 Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a snake? 11 If you, then, though you are evil, know how to give god gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give good gifts to those who ask him!

I find it incredibly hard to believe that God is only at work in the lives of Christians. It makes little sense.

In short, I am not sure how much faith I have in Christianity. I know I do not have much faith in Jesus, though I think he's a really cool guy and all. I have experienced God. I believe in God.

I'm not sure what will happen if I decide to pursue something else. Will God damn me because I gave up on Jesus? Is pursuing something else a cop out on the faith? If I pursue something else, will I eventually abandon whatever faith I have in religion itself? I'm paralyzed by indecision and fear.

Edit: Just some additional thoughts...
One thing that sort of turns me off from Christianity is how everybody seems to pretend to know everything about the state of things and of God. There is no mystery to it. We obviously know everything God plans and thinks. This impression of knowing even the smallest details bothers me. It makes me feel like there is nothing left to oneself and God, nothing for you to discover on your own, nothing for God to teach you. Everything is taught to you. You are told it's truth even if you don't feel like it's truth. You are encouraged to glaze everything over, to look upon your doubts as your faults and feel ashamed of them. What if your doubts are your instincts? What if they're right? Is it healthy to ignore them? Are you shortchanging your spiritual development?

I feel like I know what answers I am going to be getting on this forum, but I figured I would ask anyway.

[jengoesup]

No one?

[tlj009]

No one?

Well I started to answer but I don't really know what you mean by "every person in every faith has experienced some part of God". That seems to be a big part of your argument because if everyone can experience a part then what makes one part better than another.

If you just want some straight answers on your other questions then that is OK. I think most of the answers are readily found. For example, salvation is only found through Jesus. The trouble with your indecision is this. We have ways of knowing the Truth because we don't just read something and make our own decisions. God gives the Holy Spirit to those who believe. You seem to think that Christianity is all about listening to the pastor or something but it isn't. It is about listening to the Holy Spirit. I think that it is very clear that we should test each and every teaching that we hear. We can't just take someone's word for it. Christianity is a personal thing and God deals with us on a personal level.

[joshaber]

Originally Posted by jengoesup

How does one come to a conclusion on the correct religion? In a sense that's a ridiculous question, because if it were obvious which one it were everybody would be united under one banner. It just seems as if every person in every faith has experienced some part of God. I don't feel that God would let these people experience Himself if He just planned on damning them later.

Maybe he lets them experience him in hopes that it will draw them to him. I'm a fan of the idea that there's some truth in all religions.

I find it incredibly hard to believe that God is only at work in the lives of Christians. It makes little sense.

I'm not quite sure what you mean, but I would say God works in the lives of everyone.

I'm not sure what will happen if I decide to pursue something else. Will God damn me because I gave up on Jesus? Is pursuing something else a cop out on the faith?

I'm pretty sure you know the Christian answer here, even if you don't like it...

One thing that sort of turns me off from Christianity is how everybody seems to pretend to know everything about the state of things and of God. There is no mystery to it. We obviously know everything God plans and thinks. This impression of knowing even the smallest details bothers me. It makes me feel like there is nothing left to oneself and God, nothing for you to discover on your own, nothing for God to teach you. Everything is taught to you. You are told it's truth even if you don't feel like it's truth. You are encouraged to glaze everything over, to look upon your doubts as your faults and feel ashamed of them. What if your doubts are your instincts? What if they're right? Is it healthy to ignore them? Are you shortchanging your spiritual development?

The lack of mystery is largely a Western, Protestant thing, I think. If you look at the Catholic church or the Orthodox church you'll see they both have a greater sense of mystery. And some of this is also the effect modernism had on the church to where we had to have everything figured out. But you're right -- it's bothersome and kinda annoying.

It might be helpful to look at it from the Christians perspective though. Most of us are so convinced it's true that of course we're going to tell you it's the truth. Of course we'll view doubts as a bad thing and something that must be cured.

One of your first questions was how someone finds the true religion. And heck, I'm willing to bet you know the arguments for the Christian faith. I wonder if your doubts come more from how Christianity seems ridiculous in a modern culture?

[Nate]

What kind of church have you been going to, Jen? There are certainly Christian churches out there that will embrace the mysteries of Christianity and accept that fallen human beings have doubts.

Originally Posted by jengoesup

How does one come to a conclusion on the correct religion? In a sense that's a ridiculous question, because if it were obvious which one it were everybody would be united under one banner.

It's not a ridiculous question; it's a difficult question, which is why most people and churches avoid it altogether. I don't know the answer. Most people, to tell the truth, choose a religion based on what their parents taught them or what their society taught them. Does this lead some people to the correct religion? Probably. Does this lead some people to the incorrect religion? Absolutely. How can we know the difference? It's hard to say.

Obviously the Christians here will tell you that Christianity is the correct religion and will list a wide variety of reasons; Muslims, Jews, Hindus, and Buddhists will probably list many of the same reasons for their religion being correct. I think the best way to choose a religion when one is in doubt is to look at your conscience, which even your fallen nature under Christian theology leaves intact, and see which religion lines up with what your conscience tells you.

This is not to say that you should force your own beliefs upon religion and choose based on your own feelings only, but I do believe that God has put inside of everyone the basic ability to tell right from wrong, and the basic ability to see truth and respond to it. Your best bet is to take a hard look at each religion you are considering, see whether it rings true in the deepest part of you (much deeper than just your "gut feelings" about what God should be like), and follow in faith that religion that seems to contain the truth.

That's a lot of words to say this: "For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth. For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse."

It just seems as if every person in every faith has experienced some part of God. I don't feel that God would let these people experience Himself if He just planned on damning them later.

See the passage I quoted above. It is not that God reveals Himself to them and then damns them because they don't understand Him fully or worship Him correctly. He damns them because, although they could, as you say, see and experience God, they deny Him and suppress the truth about Him so that they can set up their own truths.

"For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Claiming to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things. Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen."

I find it incredibly hard to believe that God is only at work in the lives of Christians. It makes little sense.

Of course it doesn't, because it's false. Nonbelievers, however, suppress the work of God in their lives by substituting His truth for a lie and by, yes, denying His Son whom He sent for their salvation.

In short, I am not sure how much faith I have in Christianity. I know I do not have much faith in Jesus, though I think he's a really cool guy and all. I have experienced God. I believe in God.

I'm not sure what will happen if I decide to pursue something else. Will God damn me because I gave up on Jesus?

If you are not a Christian and have not placed your trust in Jesus Christ for your salvation, then, yes, God will damn you for your lack of trust in His Son. Christianity offers no other answer to you. Sorry.

Is pursuing something else a cop out on the faith? If I pursue something else, will I eventually abandon whatever faith I have in religion itself? I'm paralyzed by indecision and fear.

I don't think it's religion at all that you feel you want to have faith in or that you fear losing faith in. I think you fear, and rightfully so, that if you leave the truth of Christianity it will harm your faith in God.

Edit: Just some additional thoughts...
One thing that sort of turns me off from Christianity is how everybody seems to pretend to know everything about the state of things and of God. There is no mystery to it. We obviously know everything God plans and thinks. This impression of knowing even the smallest details bothers me. It makes me feel like there is nothing left to oneself and God, nothing for you to discover on your own, nothing for God to teach you. Everything is taught to you. You are told it's truth even if you don't feel like it's truth. You are encouraged to glaze everything over, to look upon your doubts as your faults and feel ashamed of them. What if your doubts are your instincts? What if they're right? Is it healthy to ignore them? Are you shortchanging your spiritual development?

Any Christian who tells you that they "know everything about the state of things and of God" is lying to you. If a church does not embrace the mysteries of God and of salvation, they are in error. Christianity is a very mysterious religion, not in the sense of some kind of Da Vinci Code search for hidden meanings, but in the sense of the truths of Christianity far surpassing our ability to comprehend them. Doubt is a natural response to things that surpass our ability to understand. Christianity does not ask that you give up your doubts, only that you press through them and believe that God will do what He says even when it doesn't make sense to you.

[Nate]

Do you own a copy of C. S. Lewis' "Mere Christianity," Jen? It is widely regarded, including by me, as one of the best apologetic works for Christianity ever written. You owe it to yourself, if you are wanting to know how Christians can believe that Christianity is correct and all other religions false, to read this book, or at least the first third of it. The first part of the book is written in a very logical, step-by-step fashion, starting with very basic and generic "religious" ideas and working forward to fully "Christian" ideas. My advice when reading the book as an apologetic work is to go chapter by chapter through the first part of the book and stop once you get to something that makes no sense to you or that you absolutely cannot agree with. Consider what Lewis is saying about Christianity or religion, think about why you disagree, and see whether the problem is with you or with Christianity / religion in general.

[+SEAL+]

Originally Posted by joshaber

The lack of mystery is largely a Western, Protestant thing, I think. If you look at the Catholic church or the Orthodox church you'll see they both have a greater sense of mystery. And some of this is also the effect modernism had on the church to where we had to have everything figured out. But you're right -- it's bothersome and kinda annoying.

Agree 100%. If you read through Catholic theologians, you'll find a ton of stuff, a lot of philosophy and the like, it's really cool.

There's much more to Christianity than the Bible.

[irtrogdor]

I think of christianity this way. we believe there is only one God, and that he sent his word in the form of the bible to teach us. the bible says that you either accept Jesus and live in heaven for ever, or you don't and you live in hell forever. your choice. there is no in-between.

i don't mean to be harsh, but christianity is an all-or-none "religion". i don't consider it to be a "religion" because i believe it to be true. and, acording to the bible, there is no other "religion" that is true. so that's that.

[jengoesup]

Originally Posted by Nate

Do you own a copy of C. S. Lewis' "Mere Christianity," Jen? It is widely regarded, including by me, as one of the best apologetic works for Christianity ever written. You owe it to yourself, if you are wanting to know how Christians can believe that Christianity is correct and all other religions false, to read this book, or at least the first third of it. The first part of the book is written in a very logical, step-by-step fashion, starting with very basic and generic "religious" ideas and working forward to fully "Christian" ideas. My advice when reading the book as an apologetic work is to go chapter by chapter through the first part of the book and stop once you get to something that makes no sense to you or that you absolutely cannot agree with. Consider what Lewis is saying about Christianity or religion, think about why you disagree, and see whether the problem is with you or with Christianity / religion in general.

I do own a copy, but it's at home and not with me at college. I'll get it from the library.

I never feel guided in my faith, as if God were acting. I feel as if I'm trying to figure it out all for myself.

Originally Posted by Nate

This is not to say that you should force your own beliefs upon religion and choose based on your own feelings only, but I do believe that God has put inside of everyone the basic ability to tell right from wrong, and the basic ability to see truth and respond to it. Your best bet is to take a hard look at each religion you are considering, see whether it rings true in the deepest part of you (much deeper than just your "gut feelings" about what God should be like), and follow in faith that religion that seems to contain the truth.

To be honest, the religion that has so far resonated the most strongly with me is Buddhism. I am attracted to Islam because of the respect that God is given, the stringent times for prayer, the ritual, etc. However upon reading the Qur'an I started disagreeing with it...maybe this is just a cultural issue. Maybe I don't have respect for Christianity, because again it "feels" like I know everything. Everything about Christianity is supposed to be in the Bible, and if you study it long enough you're supposed to figure it out. I stopped reading the Bible for that reason, I think. Once I'd gone through it I thought, well, what's the point? What hasn't been read? This is all it is. I don't know, I suppose Islam is like that, but I haven't read the whole Qur'an. Buddhism is about the search for Truth and making yourself into the best person you can be, so maybe that's why it's appealing. But Christianity is passive. It doesn't really say anything about discovering Truth because this is what it is. The spiritual journey is about conforming to already revealed Truth. There is nothing mysterious about God, these are His qualities and now you need to emulate them. I don't know what a deeper relationship with God under Christianity would be like except feeling better when you pray to Him or feeling less doubt. What is the point of prayer in Christianity? Does He really want to hear about me all the time? When I pray, I don't even know how Jesus fits into the equation. I pray to God but then I feel, "Well, do I say something to Jesus now?" I want to spiritually rise above myself, to discover new places, deeper meanings that haven't been told to me. I want to be a moral person. I want to be a better person. Maybe, (most likely) I just don't understand this religion. After you get saved, what do you do? Where do you go to? Where are you taken?

How do I know that God is merciful, that He will always give me second chances on everything? I don't even feel comfortable exploring other thoughts. Every time I discover something spiritually new I think s***, I've renounced Jesus and now I'm definitely screwed because I thought something was more true or that Christianity was probably wrong at that point in time.

Originally Posted by Nate

Of course it doesn't, because it's false. Nonbelievers, however, suppress the work of God in their lives by substituting His truth for a lie and by, yes, denying His Son whom He sent for their salvation.

So why would God allow people to immerse themselves in Him through other spiritual practices, allow people to give praise to Him above all others for His blessing, and then say to those people, sorry, but because you didn't believe in my Son, just Me, you're damned? I guess the answer would be that Jesus would feel slighted, because He was the one who did the work. Therefore they're not giving Him credit where credit is due.

What does salvation mean, then? Why is God saving you from Himself? Right hand's gotta stop the left hand from damning people...that almost sounds like He has a split personality. I know the stock answer, that God is perfectly just in His decisions. He is Absolute Justice, and cannot deny Himself. God also cannot lie. Therefore, He sent Himself, who was also His Son, as a perfect sacrifice. Unlike the meats that the Jews burned in the Old Testament to God, God's Son is a perfect sacrifice because it does not pacify God, does not "buy his favor", but actually has the result of remission of sins. If one only believes that this sacrifice has done away with your sins, their sins will be forgiven. But if you don't accept Jesus as your sacrifice, if you don't participate in that ceremony, believing in the act, then how can God forgive your sins? You haven't committed the ultimate act of repentance. Jesus willingly gave Himself as the sacrifice. What we have to do is offer it. It is only through His love that we were able to obtain access to such a sacrifice.

This actually makes more sense when I write it out...

In a way though, I wish that God accepted a permanent sacrifice. Instead, it seems one can unmake the sacrifice. Which stinks, because according to Hebrews 6, once you unmake it you're screwed. There is no second chance. You have tasted and now that you've given up, all the tears, all the repentence, all the love that could be borne for God in your heart will fall on deaf ears. Why would God be so heartless?

This is all really rambling...though from asking these questions, one notices that the difference between Christianity and open ended religions such as Buddhism are that in Buddhism, one fines ones' own truth. Having found your own truth, it makes sense to you because you know how you got there and you know how it makes sense, even if the truth you discover is because of a leap of faith. You got there. Christianity asks you to suspend reality until you believe. And then you wonder if you brainwashed yourself so that you wouldn't be filled with panging doubts all the time and wondering if God really is there for you or is mad at your lack of faith, or if He will stick out His arm and catch you if you're going the wrong way, or if once you come back up the right way He'll still be there or if there will be an iron gate barring your path. Or if you even started on the right path at all. [/end ramble]

Actually I'm not finished. Christianity always makes me feel terrible about myself. Well not always. But most of the time. Why is that? Is it supposed to have that effect? Other spiritual traditions are about healing oneself. My experiences have been about tearing yourself down, about crying with some pastor because you're a terrible person. I always feel failed. As this one poster says, Catholicism is "if s*** happens, you deserve it". I have no idea how to live up to His expectations. I have no idea what the path is except that some days I'm on it (days where I'm committing little sin) and others days I am not it (lots of sin). How do you know you're making upward progress?

[Nate]

Jen, I see so much in your post that I want to respond to, but don't have the time right now. Would you mind if we continued this particular element of discussion in PM or via email (NateStraight@gmail.com)? I would love to really get into a deep discussion of this with you, but I have a feeling it would just run the thread way off-track and fill up the forum with stuff no one's interested in but you and me. Shoot me a PM or an email if that's alright, and I'll form a reply to this most recent post in the meantime.

[jengoesup]

Check your PMs.

[JoelWildtree]

Originally Posted by jengoesup

How does one come to a conclusion on the correct religion? In a sense that's a ridiculous question, because if it were obvious which one it were everybody would be united under one banner. It just seems as if every person in every faith has experienced some part of God. I don't feel that God would let these people experience Himself if He just planned on damning them later.

The answer is that most people come to their conclusion on a particular religion because they either were raised in an environment in which that was the common belief, and thus were raised as well to believe it; or, were exposed to that particular religion during a period of emotional distress in which they needed *something more*. It's a great thought experiment to consider what would come of your beliefs if you had been raised in another religion, and taught that it was the truth. Of course no matter which belief you hold to, as long as that religion offers the comfort of a God, then you are in a way "experiencing God". But it's important to note that different religions offer specifically different definitions of the God they worship, and obviously not all of those Gods can exist, and simultaneously portray all of the characteristics of each religion's beliefs, all within one entity. Would a God of one religion let a follower of another religion believe in him and experience him, but attribute it all to that persons own interpretation and beliefs. That would most obviously lead that person further away from the concept of God of the religion which got it right.

Originally Posted by jengoesup

In short, I am not sure how much faith I have in Christianity. I know I do not have much faith in Jesus, though I think he's a really cool guy and all. I have experienced God. I believe in God.

I'm not sure what will happen if I decide to pursue something else. Will God damn me because I gave up on Jesus? Is pursuing something else a cop out on the faith? If I pursue something else, will I eventually abandon whatever faith I have in religion itself? I'm paralyzed by indecision and fear.

A cop out would be going with the easiest explanation simply because it's the easiest. Pursuing other things is not easy, as it requires you to step outside of mental or physical bounds you've regularly imposed on yourself. Therefore I'd say it's certainly not a cop-out. How will you know the truth for yourself if you only allow your mind to believe one thing? What fear do you feel in pursuing something outside of Christianity? My guess is that you don't want to lose God, and thus you are trying to rationalize why God will still be with you, and allow you to experience him whatever you pursue.

Originally Posted by jengoesup

One thing that sort of turns me off from Christianity is how everybody seems to pretend to know everything about the state of things and of God. There is no mystery to it. We obviously know everything God plans and thinks. This impression of knowing even the smallest details bothers me. It makes me feel like there is nothing left to oneself and God, nothing for you to discover on your own, nothing for God to teach you. Everything is taught to you. You are told it's truth even if you don't feel like it's truth. You are encouraged to glaze everything over, to look upon your doubts as your faults and feel ashamed of them. What if your doubts are your instincts? What if they're right? Is it healthy to ignore them? Are you shortchanging your spiritual development?

Everyone wants to know the mind of God. No matter what religion you talk about, people will claim to know the mind of God. There is a big difference between reading a book and finding out man's opinion of what they want God to be, and how you approach and interpret those opinions for yourself. You fairly well summed up what religion is there, and why its so comfortable for people.

Someone may read the Bible, and tell you how to live your life ... but this is your life were talking about, not some game. Read it for yourself, find out if what they are telling you is really what the Bible is saying. Don't just trust yourself, get opinions from everywhere. Everyone on this planet has just as much say in what the Bible says as your preacher, or your parents. Don't stop there though, read another book that claims to know the mind of God, read the Koran and other religious texts. If you must believe in God, but chose only to read the Bible .. then the only logical place you will end up is believing the God as described in the Bible.

[Dark Tofu]

The question you are asking is in no way ridiculous. I'm sure that most people would admit that they have doubts and questions about the belief (or lack thereof) that they follow. To question the belief that you are taught to believe only shows that you are of a sound and rational mind. You want a reasonable justification rather than just being told what to do.
This is a frequent question in many belief systems (particularly those of Islam and Christianity) because, in general, the Church or Mosque will respond to any questions regarding why you should believe something with, "You just have to have faith." (in some way or another) I think that this answer in general causes the birth and growth of doubts in believers.
The reason it causes such question in believers is because the argument between different religious groups becomes, "My invisible guy in the sky is more real than your invisible guy in the sky." They call you to have blind faith in something, that kind of faith where you must ignore all evidence, no matter what fallacies it shows in your current beliefs, and blindly accept what you are told as correct because it is.
And because you seem to already believe in some sort of God, this brings me to what I have written in my signature.
"God abides in the truth, and the truth will find itself out. It can only do so when it's allowed to though. Blind faith blocks the process of reason that allows people to discover the truth. Therefore, blind faith must be done away with, and replaced with a rational faith, where you reason everything out that you possibly can and then let faith fill the gap to whatever's most reasonable."
As you can see, rational faith is the only kind of faith that can lead us to God. That isn't to say that it won't take some faith to fill in the gaps to whatever is most reasonable. But, it will be a jump of faith that makes sense to you as opposed to just assuming what you're told is right.
With this in mind I would suggest you read the Bible, the Koran, and other major religious texts of those religions that seem to be possible to you. I would not suggest that you read any books that are interpretations or explaination of any belief, other than the fundamental books that contain the system of beliefs and concepts. At least not until you have come to a decision about which belief system you will follow. I would also push you away from any books that try to 'prove' any religion, or lack thereof. This just cannot be done.
Because the supernatural is outside of the natural and beyond the natural, it follows that the natural cannot prove the existance of the supernatural. Even if one believes that the supernatural created the natural, the natural will only show traits of the supernatural, it will not prove its existance.

Now, I have a few things to say about some of what you said.

I find it incredibly hard to believe that God is only at work in the lives of Christians. It makes little sense.

God tries to work in the lives of every man. If a man rejects God from his life, then he cannot work in their life (without interfering with their free will.)

I'm not sure what will happen if I decide to pursue something else. Will God damn me because I gave up on Jesus? Is pursuing something else a cop out on the faith? If I pursue something else, will I eventually abandon whatever faith I have in religion itself? I'm paralyzed by indecision and fear.

I'm not sure what you are asking here. According to Christianity, Jesus is the way. There is no other way according to Christianity. So yes. From a Christian's perspective, if you reject Jesus and never return to him in repentance in a true desire of a relationship, you will be damned to the lake of fire.

One thing that sort of turns me off from Christianity is how everybody seems to pretend to know everything about the state of things and of God. There is no mystery to it. We obviously know everything God plans and thinks. This impression of knowing even the smallest details bothers me. It makes me feel like there is nothing left to oneself and God, nothing for you to discover on your own, nothing for God to teach you.

Though some Churches may have claimed to have discovered all the truths of the Bible and such, no person or group could ever do such a thing.
Check out the theology forum, or the devotions forum. There are always new things to learn and think about and consider in Christianity.

Originally Posted by jengoesup

I never feel guided in my faith, as if God were acting. I feel as if I'm trying to figure it out all for myself.

I actually understand what you are saying here too. I myself have had trouble with this very concept as well. I think one thing to remember is that for starters, God cannot work in your life unless you truely believe and want him to. Secondly, I think that some churches turn conversion into an emotional experience, so they can get more converts. But, when the emotional high has worn off, the person is left wondering. That is not the feeling you should be getting from God. Prayer is an extremely important part of this.

I pray to God but then I feel, "Well, do I say something to Jesus now?"

God is Jesus according to Christianity. If you thank God, you are thanking Jesus. They are two different views of the same being.

After you get saved, what do you do? Where do you go to? Where are you taken?

Well, if I understand your question, after you are saved, you should be growing your relationship with Jesus, fulfilling the Great Commision, reading and studying the Word, etc. You don't really go anywhere, per se. If you mean after we die, well that is not completely agreed upon. In the end, though, Christians agree that we will live in the New Heaven on the New Earth.

How do I know that God is merciful, that He will always give me second chances on everything?

I suppose that depends on the perspective you are coming from. From a Christian perspective, it is quite clear according to the Scriptures that God is merciful. I suppose from a standpoint where you are searching for the truth, you don't really know. Your viewpoint all depends on the belief system you choose. But, that doesn't mean your viewpoint is right. This question will potentially determine your eternal damnation or your eternal life or your trip to Nirvana or your death or whatever other final outcome might be correct.

I don't even feel comfortable exploring other thoughts. Every time I discover something spiritually new I think s***, I've renounced Jesus and now I'm definitely screwed because I thought something was more true or that Christianity was probably wrong at that point in time.

You aren't screwed if you renounce Jesus. You can just come back to him, ask for forgiveness, and start carrying your cross daily.

So why would God allow people to immerse themselves in Him through other spiritual practices, allow people to give praise to Him above all others for His blessing, and then say to those people, sorry, but because you didn't believe in my Son, just Me, you're damned? I guess the answer would be that Jesus would feel slighted, because He was the one who did the work. Therefore they're not giving Him credit where credit is due.

No. That is not the answer. (This is how I try to explain it.) The reason is that God is holy (i.e. pure and perfect) and that man is pretty much the opposite of that. God created man perfect, but with a nature that desired to go against God (sin), that he could choose God and therefore have meaningful worship. Man sinned (the fall). Then came Judaism. This was how man tried to get to God through his own works. It didn't work, and God knew it wouldn't, which brings us to His Son (who is God). Jesus came to the Earth, died perfect, lived through death, and became our way to God. Without Jesus, man cannot get to God. It isn't that God doesn't want those men, it is that they are sinful and therefore can't be with him. Jesus wipes us clean so that God can see us pure and we can live with him Holy. So, you have to believe in Jesus because he is the way, the truth, and the life. No one can come to the father except through him.

What does salvation mean, then? Why is God saving you from Himself? Right hand's gotta stop the left hand from damning people...that almost sounds like He has a split personality. I know the stock answer, that God is perfectly just in His decisions. He is Absolute Justice, and cannot deny Himself. God also cannot lie. Therefore, He sent Himself, who was also His Son, as a perfect sacrifice. Unlike the meats that the Jews burned in the Old Testament to God, God's Son is a perfect sacrifice because it does not pacify God, does not "buy his favor", but actually has the result of remission of sins. If one only believes that this sacrifice has done away with your sins, their sins will be forgiven. But if you don't accept Jesus as your sacrifice, if you don't participate in that ceremony, believing in the act, then how can God forgive your sins? You haven't committed the ultimate act of repentance. Jesus willingly gave Himself as the sacrifice. What we have to do is offer it. It is only through His love that we were able to obtain access to such a sacrifice.

This actually makes more sense when I write it out...

That sound right.

In a way though, I wish that God accepted a permanent sacrifice. Instead, it seems one can unmake the sacrifice. Which stinks, because according to Hebrews 6, once you unmake it you're screwed.

I disagree with this. That is not what Hebrews 6 is saying.

There is no second chance. You have tasted and now that you've given up, all the tears, all the repentence, all the love that could be borne for God in your heart will fall on deaf ears. Why would God be so heartless?

The verse is saying that if you experience everything a man on earth could experience, (visions of heaven, hear God's voice, prophecies from God, etc.) and you still deny Jesus, there is nothing that could bring you to Jesus. Not than you can't come back, but, what is left to convince you if you have seen all of the goodness of God and still deny him?

Actually I'm not finished. Christianity always makes me feel terrible about myself. Well not always. But most of the time. Why is that? Is it supposed to have that effect? Other spiritual traditions are about healing oneself. My experiences have been about tearing yourself down, about crying with some pastor because you're a terrible person. I always feel failed. As this one poster says, Catholicism is "if s*** happens, you deserve it". I have no idea how to live up to His expectations. I have no idea what the path is except that some days I'm on it (days where I'm committing little sin) and others days I am not it (lots of sin). How do you know you're making upward progress?

If s*** happens, you are going though a trial. (Read James 1) That doesn't mean you deserve it. Trails will test and grow your faith more than anything else. Everyone sins. Yes, hopefully you will sin less as you grow, but even if you do sin, it doesn't mean you aren't saved.

Anyway, there is my take on everything.

[bryanfal]

When it comes down to religios choices. I tend to start with logic. When I teach and instruct students on this whole subject, we hold highly to the law of Non-contradiction. This law states that something cannot be both A and not A at the same time, unless qualified.

For instance, i cannot say that my wife is both pregnant and not pregnant at the same time. She cannot exist that way.

And there are many statements like this in religious systems. Christianity, Buddhism, Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, etc, are all at odds with each other. Because the root of their doctrines disagree. So they cannot be all true if the law of non contradiction holds up.

Then you can take this law and apply it into the fabric of each individual religious system in order to weed out the ones that are false in themselves because of contradictory doctrines. For instance, the mormon church claims to hold true to the new testament which claims that Jesus said, I am the way the truth and the life, no one comes to the father except through me. But then goes on to claim that they only way to the father is to be baptized into the church. So which is it? A or not A, it cannot be both. Illogical doctrine at the core. So, it can be thrown out automatically.

Of course, we also cannot forget that logic must correspond with reality. With history, with nature, etc. So you also need to look at that. Again to pick on Mormon religion. The Book of Mormon claims that the Native American population comes from ancient Jews that traveled on a boat to get to America, well we KNOW through history, archaeology and DNA mapping, that the Native Americans were of mongolian decent mostly. So again, it does not exist in reality and must be thrown out.

Try that and see what kind of a list of religious systems you come up with that logically make sense.

Good luck, God bless, and I am glad that you are questioning.

For help understanding the logical outworkings of many religious systems, I highly reccommend just about anything by Ravi Zacharias. Particularly, Jesus among other Gods.

[Reedolo]

Originally Posted by jengoesup

How does one come to a conclusion on the correct religion? In a sense that's a ridiculous question, because if it were obvious which one it were everybody would be united under one banner. It just seems as if every person in every faith has experienced some part of God. I don't feel that God would let these people experience Himself if He just planned on damning them later. As Jesus says in Matthew 7:

9 Which of you, if his son asks for bread, will live him a stone? 10 Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a snake? 11 If you, then, though you are evil, know how to give god gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give good gifts to those who ask him!

I find it incredibly hard to believe that God is only at work in the lives of Christians. It makes little sense.

In short, I am not sure how much faith I have in Christianity. I know I do not have much faith in Jesus, though I think he's a really cool guy and all. I have experienced God. I believe in God.

I'm not sure what will happen if I decide to pursue something else. Will God damn me because I gave up on Jesus? Is pursuing something else a cop out on the faith? If I pursue something else, will I eventually abandon whatever faith I have in religion itself? I'm paralyzed by indecision and fear.

Edit: Just some additional thoughts...
One thing that sort of turns me off from Christianity is how everybody seems to pretend to know everything about the state of things and of God. There is no mystery to it. We obviously know everything God plans and thinks. This impression of knowing even the smallest details bothers me. It makes me feel like there is nothing left to oneself and God, nothing for you to discover on your own, nothing for God to teach you. Everything is taught to you. You are told it's truth even if you don't feel like it's truth. You are encouraged to glaze everything over, to look upon your doubts as your faults and feel ashamed of them. What if your doubts are your instincts? What if they're right? Is it healthy to ignore them? Are you shortchanging your spiritual development?

I feel like I know what answers I am going to be getting on this forum, but I figured I would ask anyway.

In response to this I just want to say that God is not going to damn you for honestly seeking. If it is true that "he who seeks shall find", and you are honestly seeking the truth, then you will find the truth.

peace