[dogfood]

i was a sinner

[Ax]

Originally Posted by dogfood

i was a sinner

You still are and so am I. Nobody, not even after salvation, stops sinning for good. A sinner is one who sins, and that is what you and I both are, as well as everybody you've ever met and ever will meet. [/not cheap]

[Adam K]

Originally Posted by AXguitar

You still are and so am I. Nobody, not even after salvation, stops sinning for good. A sinner is one who sins, and that is what you and I both are, as well as everybody you've ever met and ever will meet. [/not cheap]

Your identity doesn't come from what you do. So I disagree.
just because I fix one flat tire, it doesn't make me a mechanic.

[Deuceswild26]

I don't think that he is saying a sinner is your identity. Although I am curious where you personally think that your identity comes from.

Sinning makes you a sinner just as fixing a flat tire makes you the fixer of a flat tire.

[Ax]

Originally Posted by Adam K

Your identity doesn't come from what you do. So I disagree.
just because I fix one flat tire, it doesn't make me a mechanic.

I wasn't saying that it was you identity, but I will argue that what you do is what defines you.

Originally Posted by Deuceswild26

Sinning makes you a sinner just as fixing a flat tire makes you the fixer of a flat tire.

My point exactly.

[tropicana]

Originally Posted by Adam K

Your identity doesn't come from what you do. So I disagree.
just because I fix one flat tire, it doesn't make me a mechanic.

That's kind of a lousy analogy. Mechanics do a lot of things other than fix flat tires. A "mechanic" is someone who possesses a certain skill set, the skills that allow him to repair/build planes, trains, automoblies, or what-have-you. It's not his entire identity; he may also be a husband, father, jogger, and hobbyist guinea pig farmer, but all of those things that he does contribute to his identity as a whole.
A "sinner" is, simply, one who sins. There is no complex skill set required to be a sinner, like there is to be a mechanic. To be a sinner, one must merely commit a sin. I'm sure most people here would agree that "sins" are things that make one fall short in the eyes of God. And, according to your Bible, "all have sinned, and come short of the glory of the Lord" (from the oft-recited Romans 3:23). Because the Christian soiterology is contingent on humankind's sin and the neccesity for divine salvation, and you claim to be a Christian, I think it is safe to assume you have sinned. You are a sinner.
The things one chooses to do contribute to one's identity. If you change a tire, you are not a mechanic, because, most likely, you do not have all the skills mechanics need to have. If you sin, you are a sinner, because the only thing one needs to do to be a sinner is to commit a sin.

[Adam K]

Originally Posted by tropicana

That's kind of a lousy analogy. Mechanics do a lot of things other than fix flat tires. A "mechanic" is someone who possesses a certain skill set, the skills that allow him to repair/build planes, trains, automoblies, or what-have-you. It's not his entire identity; he may also be a husband, father, jogger, and hobbyist guinea pig farmer, but all of those things that he does contribute to his identity as a whole.
A "sinner" is, simply, one who sins. There is no complex skill set required to be a sinner, like there is to be a mechanic. To be a sinner, one must merely commit a sin. I'm sure most people here would agree that "sins" are things that make one fall short in the eyes of God. And, according to your Bible, "all have sinned, and come short of the glory of the Lord" (from the oft-recited Romans 3:23). Because the Christian soiterology is contingent on humankind's sin and the neccesity for divine salvation, and you claim to be a Christian, I think it is safe to assume you have sinned. You are a sinner.
The things one chooses to do contribute to one's identity. If you change a tire, you are not a mechanic, because, most likely, you do not have all the skills mechanics need to have. If you sin, you are a sinner, because the only thing one needs to do to be a sinner is to commit a sin.

But that's not who you are. Your identity comes from what Christ has done, not from what you've done, are doing or will do.

[Deuceswild26]

I'm not arguing that your identity comes from your sin but it is wrong to say that you are saved and therefore are not sinning.

[tropicana]

Originally Posted by Adam K

But that's not who you are. Your identity comes from what Christ has done, not from what you've done, are doing or will do.

Then define your useage of "identity" for me, please.

[Adam K]

Originally Posted by Deuceswild26

I'm not arguing that your identity comes from your sin but it is wrong to say that you are saved and therefore are not sinning.

I didn't say not sinning. not a sinner, as in a practicer of sin, but a practicer of righteousness.

[Adam K]

Originally Posted by tropicana

Then define your useage of "identity" for me, please.

what you are defined by

[Deuceswild26]

by whom?

[Adam K]

Originally Posted by Deuceswild26

by whom?

by whom?what?

what I meant was a drunkard is called a drunkard because he practices drinking regularly, if a person gets drunk once their whole life it doesn't make them a drunkard.

[Ax]

Originally Posted by Adam K

But that's not who you are. Your identity comes from what Christ has done, not from what you've done, are doing or will do.

MMM no.

Christ may have died to atone for our sins, but that doesn't mean that they never happened. Every year the high priest would sacrifice a goat (the scape goat) to atone for the sins of Israel committed out of ignorance, I would say that their identity did not come from the scape goat. According to the Bible we have Free-Will (I say this and yet I believe in pre-destination, but only as far as God's foreknowlege and omniscience is concerned) and it is our decision to accept Christ's sacrifice or not. Therefore even though Christ died for the sins of the world, only those who choose to receive his grace can claim to be a Christian, they are however, still sinners.

[Ax]

Originally Posted by Adam K

what I meant was say a drunkard is called a drunkard because he practices drinking regularly, if a person gets drunk once their whole life it doesn't make them a drunk.

And we all sin. We have sinned, and will continue to sin.