[J_freek]

What is everyone's view on prophesy?
What is it's function in the church?

[PROPHETSONG]

Prophecy is a message given by inspiration of the Holy Spirit, it is litterally the Lord Jesus Christ speaking through the Spirit working through one of his children. Anyone can prophesy, and Paul encourages all to prophesy.
The Bible gives general guidelines to follow it is what God has said, it is the inspired word of God. Prophecy is what God is saying at the moment. When God speaks in this manner it stirs up secret things, hidden things, deep from within, and brings light to the deepest things of God. The purpose of prophecy is loving redemption. God uses prophesy to exhort, the greek word for this used in the Bible refers to a drawing near.So prophecy is an avenue God uses to draw the saved and unsaved closer to himself.
The prophetic voice is gentle toward the saint whose heart is to seek the Lord, but is strongly against sin, becuase it seperates men from God. It the Word of God that is sharper than any two edged sword, it cuts deep into the heart, judgeing it's thoughts and intentions, bringing sin to the surface so that it may be forgiving, so that soul may come closer to him.
Prophecy breaks down a man's self reliance, and causes him to solely rely on his God. The prophetic word is the substance through which the written word came about. As God spoke men wrote, and the result is the blessed written word of God. Prophecy gives direction in specific areas where the Bible does not, but at the same time never contradicts it, or misapplies it.
Prophecy is used by God to prepare men for their future, and to divert others from the wrong path, so that they may find salvation. Prophecy is not based on education, but revelation. It comes and goes like the wind, but, you know it was there by the effect it leaves behind.

[Elationist]

Originally Posted by J_freek

What is everyone's view on prophesy?
What is it's function in the church?

I will state what some say:
A) To prophesy is to forth tell about God, His word and His truth.
B) To fore-tell, tell what is certain to come as news to the Church or new to the Church.
C) Combination of the A & B

Some may even have more definitions but I believe the ones above cover most of it.

Personally, I don't believe we are adding to the word of God any prophecies. Everything needed to be said, has already been said. When we prophesy, we are speaking the truth in love and sharing what it is that God has already said.

Hebrews 1:1-3 (NIV) 1 In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, 2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe. 3 The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.

To Prophesy, in the verb tense, in the biblical sense-tense: To forth tell what has been written for us to tell the world about. Here are only some: Repentance and Faith in Christ. God's holiness, His mercy, justness, His righteousness, His love and His wisdom.

Now some people may hold that there are psychics and mediums and folks who act like a soothsayer or fortune-teller or "prophets" (even they may think it is in a biblical sense)...but no, they are at best deceived and at worst deceiving. They too must all repent and trust in the Savior and once truly born again, they must be about the Father's business, forth telling His truth, as Jesus proclaimed, "in spirit and in truth".

Look how an online dictionary answers this: www.onelook.com

Quick definitions (prophesy)
verb: predict or reveal through, or as if through, divine inspiration
verb: deliver a sermon

Good question.

The function within the church is to teach, admonish, uphold sound doctrine, make disciples and train others to reach the lost with the Gospel. All Christian service-life, that genuinely serves God wholeheartedly can be summed up in those two things: Equipping the Saints, & Reaching the Lost

All this is to bring God glory. God brings Himself glory through us as the potter does through the clay he molds for glory.

Romans 15:4 (NIV) For everything that was written in the past was written to teach us, so that through endurance and the encouragement of the Scriptures we might have hope.

[PartTimeLurker]

Not to take this in a wildly different direction, but if "prophecy" is forth-telling, as in preaching, then is there any difference between that and "teaching"? Why does Ephesians 4:11 (I think...) separate the two when listing what some call the "5 fold ministry"?

Note: I'm not exactly saying that I believe this way. I'm not exactly sure what I believe in this regard, actually...

In Christ,

-- Nate

[Elationist]

Originally Posted by PartTimeLurker

Not to take this in a wildly different direction, but if "prophecy" is forth-telling, as in preaching, then is there any difference between that and "teaching"? Why does Ephesians 4:11 (I think...) separate the two when listing what some call the "5 fold ministry"?

Note: I'm not exactly saying that I believe this way. I'm not exactly sure what I believe in this regard, actually...

In Christ,

-- Nate

You know, the original word in question is "prophesy" not prophecy.

Ephesians 4 (NKJV) Spiritual Gifts

7 But to each one of us grace was given according to the measure of Christ’s gift. 8 Therefore He says:
“ When He ascended on high,
He led captivity captive,
And gave gifts to men.”[b]

9 (Now this, “He ascended”—what does it mean but that He also first[c] descended into the lower parts of the earth? 10 He who descended is also the One who ascended far above all the heavens, that He might fill all things.)
11 And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers, 12 for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ, 13 till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; 14 that we should no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting, 15 but, speaking the truth in love, may grow up in all things into Him who is the head—Christ— 16 from whom the whole body, joined and knit together by what every joint supplies, according to the effective working by which every part does its share, causes growth of the body for the edifying of itself in love.

In the sense that teaching is prophesying, it is all to glorify God by equipping the saints: "for the edifying of the body of Christ, 13 till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God.."

We can make distinctions between teaching and prophesying. I believe Nate, that is what you were asking: what are the differences? Right?

[comitatus1]

Originally Posted by PartTimeLurker

Not to take this in a wildly different direction, but if "prophecy" is forth-telling, as in preaching, then is there any difference between that and "teaching"? Why does Ephesians 4:11 (I think...) separate the two when listing what some call the "5 fold ministry"?

Note: I'm not exactly saying that I believe this way. I'm not exactly sure what I believe in this regard, actually...

In Christ,

-- Nate

That's a hard one, Nate. To me, teaching is not personal, while prophecy is. What do I mean by that? Teaching is a systematic exposition of God's Word. Its purpose is to expose what His Word means and that's about it. (Of course, that's a LOT ) Prophecy, on the other hand, is similar in that it is an exposition of God's Word, to be sure, but it is done for the purpose of revealing God's specific will to a person or persons in a given situation. I believe this will covers anything from conviction of sin to any kind of life situation.

Can a person be teaching and stray into the prophetic? I think so. Can a person be prophetic and end up teaching something? I think so. If a person is preaching to a congregation, some will take it as teaching, the impartation of knowledge, and some will take it as prophetic, as in "Here is what the Lord wants me to do!".

That's the way I look at it. Either way, it is important to keep in mind the source it God's Word and the enlivening power of the Holy Spirit.

Chris

[Deuceswild26]

Has anyone ever known a church leader who called him(or her)self prophet or prophettess? This always makes me kind of uncomfortable b/c to me a prophet is the mouthpiece of God who is actively prophesizing.

[Nomes]

Originally Posted by comitatus1

That's a hard one, Nate. To me, teaching is not personal, while prophecy is. What do I mean by that? Teaching is a systematic exposition of God's Word. Its purpose is to expose what His Word means and that's about it. (Of course, that's a LOT ) Prophecy, on the other hand, is similar in that it is an exposition of God's Word, to be sure, but it is done for the purpose of revealing God's specific will to a person or persons in a given situation. I believe this will covers anything from conviction of sin to any kind of life situation.

Can a person be teaching and stray into the prophetic? I think so. Can a person be prophetic and end up teaching something? I think so. If a person is preaching to a congregation, some will take it as teaching, the impartation of knowledge, and some will take it as prophetic, as in "Here is what the Lord wants me to do!".

That's the way I look at it. Either way, it is important to keep in mind the source it God's Word and the enlivening power of the Holy Spirit.

Chris

I agree Chris. That's a good wrap up of what prophecy is.

[PartTimeLurker]

Originally Posted by Elationist

You know, the original word in question is "prophesy" not prophecy.

Hehe...

Originally Posted by Elationist

We can make distinctions between teaching and prophesying. I believe Nate, that is what you were asking: what are the differences? Right?

Can we, under this definition? THAT's what I'm asking, because it sounds like almost exactly the same thing to me...

Originally Posted by comitatus1

That's a hard one, Nate. To me, teaching is not personal, while prophecy is. What do I mean by that? Teaching is a systematic exposition of God's Word. Its purpose is to expose what His Word means and that's about it. (Of course, that's a LOT ) Prophecy, on the other hand, is similar in that it is an exposition of God's Word, to be sure, but it is done for the purpose of revealing God's specific will to a person or persons in a given situation. I believe this will covers anything from conviction of sin to any kind of life situation.

Can a person be teaching and stray into the prophetic? I think so. Can a person be prophetic and end up teaching something? I think so. If a person is preaching to a congregation, some will take it as teaching, the impartation of knowledge, and some will take it as prophetic, as in "Here is what the Lord wants me to do!".

That's the way I look at it. Either way, it is important to keep in mind the source it God's Word and the enlivening power of the Holy Spirit.

Chris

Thanks Chris, that was quite a well reasoned response. Not sure I agree, though

As for me, I have always attended "charismatic-type" churches, and this definition of prophecy is quite new to me. The "charismatic" take on prophecy seems to me to better fit the Biblical view - considering the role of OT prophets vs the role of priests / scribes / rabbis, it would seem that the former would be declaring what the Lord says while the latter points us to what the Lord has said...

That being said...

Originally Posted by Deuceswild26

Has anyone ever known a church leader who called him(or her)self prophet or prophettess? This always makes me kind of uncomfortable b/c to me a prophet is the mouthpiece of God who is actively prophesizing.

I'm quite uncomfortable about people runnig around calling themselves (P)rophets (or Apostles, for that matter). But then again, Ephesians 4:11 tells us that God has given all these 5 (or 4 as the case may be) gifts to the church, until we all attain to the fullness of Christ... And we're not there yet...

In Christ (but not the fullness... yet)

-- Nate

[PartTimeLurker]

Originally Posted by Nomes

I agree Chris. That's a good wrap up of what prophecy is.

Really? Prophecy (only) as exposition of God's Word?

That's quite non-pentecostal of you

Seriously, I don't have a problem with that - I just didn't know you swung that way... I think I may be swinging that way, though, too...

[Nomes]

Originally Posted by PartTimeLurker

Really? Prophecy (only) as exposition of God's Word?

That's quite non-pentecostal of you

Seriously, I don't have a problem with that - I just didn't know you swung that way... I think I may be swinging that way, though, too...

Wait...what did I say? I was mislead...I WAS MISLEAAAAD! [/drama queen]

Perhaps I misunderstood Chris. Didn't he say/mean:

• "Teaching is a systematic exposition of God's Word"
• "Prophecy, on the other hand, is similar in that it is an exposition of God's Word, to be sure, but it is done for the purpose of revealing God's specific will to a person or persons in a given situation. I believe this will covers anything from conviction of sin to any kind of life situation."

I took prophecy being "specific to person(s)" or situations as not only being the exposition of God's word. And meant that it would not deviate from, but rather reinforce the word (of God) in prophesy. like...kinda...

[Elationist]

Originally Posted by Deuceswild26

Has anyone ever known a church leader who called him(or her)self prophet or prophettess? This always makes me kind of uncomfortable b/c to me a prophet is the mouthpiece of God who is actively prophesizing.

Yes, I do not believe in End Time Prophets...but...I believe the 144,000 folk and even the two witnesses may end up with this title (depends on the truth of biblical Eschatology)

Again, I would point us all to recall and memorize what Hebrews 1:1-3 says: Hebrews 1:1-3 (NIV) 1 In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, 2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe. 3 The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.

God used to use prophets and we even have the collection of "books of the prophets"--both minor and major ones. But more so, Christ Jesus is the fulfillment of the position of Prophet and He alone is the final word.

So, in addition, forth telling is available for us but fore-telling was available to them. Does that makes sense?

If the passage in Hebrews tells us anything, it is clearly that God is pleased to have spoke to us directly through His Son and that His Son is highly exalted above all ---and we also know that He will return to Judge and be with His own. God has spoken to us already through the Last Prophet, Jesus Christ. Anyone else who speaks had better line up completely with Him or else face stoning. Well, maybe something else other than a stoning.

Remember Deuteronomy 18 (NKJV)

A New Prophet Like Moses

15 “The LORD your God will raise up for you a Prophet like me from your midst, from your brethren. Him you shall hear, 16 according to all you desired of the LORD your God in Horeb in the day of the assembly, saying, ‘Let me not hear again the voice of the LORD my God, nor let me see this great fire anymore, lest I die.’
17 “And the LORD said to me: ‘What they have spoken is good. 18 I will raise up for them a Prophet like you from among their brethren, and will put My words in His mouth, and He shall speak to them all that I command Him. 19 And it shall be that whoever will not hear My words, which He speaks in My name, I will require it of him. 20 But the prophet who presumes to speak a word in My name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or who speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet shall die.’ 21 And if you say in your heart, ‘How shall we know the word which the LORD has not spoken?’— 22 when a prophet speaks in the name of the LORD, if the thing does not happen or come to pass, that is the thing which the LORD has not spoken; the prophet has spoken it presumptuously; you shall not be afraid of him.

So we see the prophecy of Christ coming [prophecy of the Prophet in Deuteronomy 18] and we see that He has already fulfilled that too (Hebrews 1:1-2 Prophet Has Spoken).

[PartTimeLurker]

Hey Mike, it makes sense, but I think there's still holes -

1 ... Was God still using prophets during the time of Acts (such as Agabus prophesying the famine), though that was post-Jesus.

2 ... When Paul wrote to the Corinthians, was he instructing women to wear veils over their heads when supernaturally speaking God's words, or when they were exegeting the Bible? What does that make of Paul's apparent prohibition on women preaching? Is it alright for women to take the pulpit, as long as they "tell people God's will in a specific situation" (according to Chris)

?!

It really seems that when it comes to words like prophecy, people can be speaking completely different languages...

-- Nate

[comitatus1]

Originally Posted by PartTimeLurker

Thanks Chris, that was quite a well reasoned response. Not sure I agree, though

As for me, I have always attended "charismatic-type" churches, and this definition of prophecy is quite new to me. The "charismatic" take on prophecy seems to me to better fit the Biblical view - considering the role of OT prophets vs the role of priests / scribes / rabbis, it would seem that the former would be declaring what the Lord says while the latter points us to what the Lord has said...

-- Nate

Nate,

But the Bible says that the Word of God is living and active...so right there I think you can begin to appreciate the trouble making a distinction in the way you have in your post.

I'm not charismatic but I do know a couple of guys who say they are prophets but they would never, ever claim that what they tell people is anywhere near on the same level as the prophetic utterances of Old Testament prophets. They would say that they think or feel

what they are saying really is from God, but that before anyone should act on what they say, it should be thoroughly checked out with God's Word and Prayer. They also both happen to be excellent teachers.

So...that's my answer and I'm sticking with it

Chris

[PartTimeLurker]

Originally Posted by comitatus1

Nate,

But the Bible says that the Word of God is living and active...so right there I think you can begin to appreciate the trouble making a distinction in the way you have in your post.

I'm not charismatic but I do know a couple of guys who say they are prophets but they would never, ever claim that what they tell people is anywhere near on the same level as the prophetic utterances of Old Testament prophets. They would say that they think or feel

what they are saying really is from God, but that before anyone should act on what they say, it should be thoroughly checked out with God's Word and Prayer. They also both happen to be excellent teachers.

So...that's my answer and I'm sticking with it

Chris

I definitely understand what you mean about finding it hard making a distinction between what God has said and is saying... but doesn't that then break down the supposed difference between teaching and prophecy (that teaching will teach you the principles and stuff in God's Word, while prophecy uses it to show you what God is "saying" now)?

The "prophets" that you mention - do they "prophesy" how you explain? Or do they get up and say "I feel that God is saying...", which should hopefully line up with what the Bible says, but doesn't actually involve standing up and reading it? That is the form that I am familiar with, but I'm not 100% sure on its Biblical faithfulness...

And I understand that you don't agree with them on this, but do you know what reason they have for believing that they are prophets while simultaneously saying that they don't have the same authority (and presumably accountability) of OT prophetic utterances? I have heard that many times, but haven't seen it in Scripture yet.

In short, I don't know exactly where I stand, and right now I'm sticking with that. I definitely still consider myself charismatic, but a little nervous about the subjectivity and bad theology that often accompanies it...

-- Nate