[BillSPrestonEsq]

Originally Posted by thrashmetal15

I personally don't hate Les Pauls, I just get so disgusted with Gibson/Epiphone. I find it very appalling when they charge 500-600 dollars for a guitar that is (according to stuff i've heard, and according to what I've played) obviously inferior to my Ibanez. I have personally made a commitment NEVER to buy anything Epiphone or Gibson because they're taking advantage of people, and making money off of SOMEONE ELSE'S incredible guitar. Sure they have the name Gibson on them, but Gibson is hardly the company it used to be.

Am I getting my point accross?

Sorta like the Medicine industry, they charge exuberant prices BECAUSE THEY CAN, not because what they're selling is actually worth that much, but because people are desperate enough to pay that much.

So in the end: (Les Paul = Good) + (Gibson/Epiphone = Bad) =

I don't know I have owned an ibanez rg 320 dx for somewhere around 10 years. I personally would trade it in a heartbeat for most gibson or epiphone lp's I have played.

[Hopeful]

Originally Posted by TG-da-JF

yeah. i respect les paul as i heard he has invented like almost anything on an electric guitar. and he made one of the first designs too with another guy(or was it gibson... oh i dunno)(at the same period of time fender showed up with the strat). if i remember well... or else im just saying a bunch of lies. maybe gibson is overrated too but i dont say that(just pretend i didnt) cuz im a lil bit too inexpirienced to say that and having it make sense too ...

Keep in mind, before the design of the "electric spanish" guitar (i.e., one that could be played like the traditional acoustic guitar), the only amplified guitars were lap steel guitars. Thus, the technology for pickups and electronics was basically there, but not in an "electric spanish" guitar. This is my understanding of the development of the electric guitar and one that could be mass produced and marketed to the public. Les Paul is credited with first coming up with the design to accomplish this, although someone else may have tinkered with it before, but never got it to the stage Les did. He also worked on his pickup design which started out as a single coil design, but which eventually ended up as a humbucker design over time. His first neck through design (2 X 4 with wings) also later turned into a set neck design.

Leo Fender came along a few years later (in about 1948) with his version which was your Tele of today (aka the Broadcaster in the beginning). Since he was an electronics guy, Leo sought to improve the pickup design and came up with his single coil design. However, in the process, he also came up with revolutionary improvements such as replaceable, bolt on necks, in-line, straight through tuners, etc. as his goal was to produce a guitar that could be sold in quantities to the public. The Strat came along later as Leo tried to improve on the Tele. The most notable improvements were the pickup configurations and body shape with more comfortable body cutouts.

These three basic designs and electronics formed the templates for most modern guitars, excepting the extreme shapes. However, there has not been any revolutionary changes that deviate from these basic guitars. That's why I would not view a Les Paul as hype, but rather a piece of history alongside the Tele and, to a lesser extent, the Strat. Any other guitar history buffs, please feel free to correct me.

[Hopeful]

Originally Posted by thrashmetal15

I personally don't hate Les Pauls, I just get so disgusted with Gibson/Epiphone. I find it very appalling when they charge 500-600 dollars for a guitar that is (according to stuff i've heard, and according to what I've played) obviously inferior to my Ibanez. I have personally made a commitment NEVER to buy anything Epiphone or Gibson because they're taking advantage of people, and making money off of SOMEONE ELSE'S incredible guitar. Sure they have the name Gibson on them, but Gibson is hardly the company it used to be.

Am I getting my point accross?

Sorta like the Medicine industry, they charge exuberant prices BECAUSE THEY CAN, not because what they're selling is actually worth that much, but because people are desperate enough to pay that much.

So in the end: (Les Paul = Good) + (Gibson/Epiphone = Bad) =

Gibsons (and Epiphones) along with Fender, PRS and other big name manufacturers are all priced at the point where the market demand says it will pay. You cannot assess a value to the franchise name of these companies other than the difference in price. It is a basic principle of economics. Your example of the medical drug industry is not a good one. For every formula that works, how many do you think fail? The costs involved in developing a drug that works and can be mass produced without a risk to the public are tremendous. These risks are usually underwritten by the companies and their investors and if their product fails, it's their loss as they have nothing to sell.

Back on point, I have said I would never get an Epiphone and frowned upon my son's wanting one even though he already had a G&L. But, his Dot is a very good guitar, and at $400 with case, it was a great deal. Would I buy another Epiphone? Why not?

Here's something else to consider. How would you justify the extra cost in buying say a Suhr, Tom Anderson, Don Grosh, Melancon, etc.? Let me answer by saying, if you can afford one and you buy one of these, or a Gibson Historic or whatever, did you really get ripped off? Not if you thought you were getting what you paid for. My other example of value is to look at the secondary market, ebay, for example. You will see that Gibson and Fender hold their values quite well. Why? Because the market drives it. I wish I could say the same for my Heritage or G&L's. Could you say the same about your Ibanez?

[thrashmetal15]

Point taken, it's all really a matter of opinion, and yes I feel my Ibanez would do good on the resale, but, I never intend to sell it, I like it that much, it's the best guitar I've ever played.

To be honest I've played some Ibanez's that were total junk, but I've played Epi's that weren't so hot either.

Lets stop talking about this, it ruffles my feathers.

The best electric guitar is the one that is right for you, all you have to do is find it, nuff said.

[Hopeful]

Originally Posted by thrashmetal15

Point taken, it's all really a matter of opinion, and yes I feel my Ibanez would do good on the resale, but, I never intend to sell it, I like it that much, it's the best guitar I've ever played.

To be honest I've played some Ibanez's that were total junk, but I've played Epi's that weren't so hot either.

Lets stop talking about this, it ruffles my feathers.

The best electric guitar is the one that is right for you, all you have to do is find it, nuff said.

In the meantime, I'm trying to help answer the original question, which was: im gunna save up for a new elect. gtr. in ur opinion what do you reckon is the best guitar to get?

You're not the only one whose feathers have been ruffled and there have been comments and recommendations made without the basis of actual experience. I could recommend a Kramer Stryker 424 here and maybe get flamed, but you know what? I would make that recommendation on the basis of having owned one. But it cannot compare with my other guitars: Heritage LP, MIJ Fender Strat, G&L Legacy and S-500 (my son's), 50th Anniversary Am. Deluxe Strat, James Burton Tele, my son's Epi Dot or my other Kramer, a MIK Classic Duo Pro which I sold at a profit. However, only the Stryker and Dot were less than $400 and I bought 5 of the above guitars used for over $425, each. So, depending on how much you have to spend for your new guitar, try any one of the above.

[gtrdave]

And my responses of "Real Men play _______" were a tongue-in-cheek retort to those folks who reply to the question of "wut gitar shoold I by?" with "Just buy a STrat. They'Re the BeSt!".

There is no 'best guitar'. There's guitars that you find appealing and those that you do not. And sometimes your best guitar for the moment is based on what you can afford or what was given to you, not what you'd prefer to play given unlimited time and resources.

And can I ask that we try to rise above the Harmony Central mindest of bashing Gibson based on what other people say instead of personal experience?
Even if you've owned a genuine Gibson and had a bad experience with it, maybe just maybe it was a bad guitar in 1000 good ones.
I've owned 3 Les Pauls (still own 1) and played many many other Gibsons (Explorers, 335s, 345s, Nighthawks, Chet Atkins, etc) and they make GREAT guitars. Yes, they cost more than your run-of-the-mill import Ibanez/LTD/Schecter/Agile but in my experience you should be able to purchase your average Les Paul, have it set-up (as you would ANY guitar) and walk into a studio or on-stage and play for many, many years without issue. Spend $2000 on a Les Paul Standard and you're going to get a professional instrument that should last you a lifetime.
Mine has gone 24 years so far.

[TG-da-JF]

why not buying a custom one from esp or so? sounds good to me. course you cant test it until its finished and so but i think its still good...

[Ryan Freeland]

Originally Posted by gtrdave

And my responses of "Real Men play _______" were a tongue-in-cheek retort to those folks who reply to the question of "wut gitar shoold I by?" with "Just buy a STrat. They'Re the BeSt!".

There is no 'best guitar'. There's guitars that you find appealing and those that you do not. And sometimes your best guitar for the moment is based on what you can afford or what was given to you, not what you'd prefer to play given unlimited time and resources.

And can I ask that we try to rise above the Harmony Central mindest of bashing Gibson based on what other people say instead of personal experience?
Even if you've owned a genuine Gibson and had a bad experience with it, maybe just maybe it was a bad guitar in 1000 good ones.
I've owned 3 Les Pauls (still own 1) and played many many other Gibsons (Explorers, 335s, 345s, Nighthawks, Chet Atkins, etc) and they make GREAT guitars. Yes, they cost more than your run-of-the-mill import Ibanez/LTD/Schecter/Agile but in my experience you should be able to purchase your average Les Paul, have it set-up (as you would ANY guitar) and walk into a studio or on-stage and play for many, many years without issue. Spend $2000 on a Les Paul Standard and you're going to get a professional instrument that should last you a lifetime.
Mine has gone 24 years so far.

Indeed. I've played a few Gibsons for only a short time at Guitar Center, and for the limited time I got to play them I really liked them. Sure they are $1000-$3000+ most of the time but you pay for the name and you pay for quality. But there are other companies, like Schecter where you can get awesome guitars for great prices. I'm still blown away by the fact that the C-1 Classic is only $700, compared to, let's say the Gibson SG or Les Paul. But if you can't afford this stuff, there is always a place that's at the "e" of the "Bay".

[CheshireCat]

Originally Posted by gtrdave

There is no 'best guitar'.

Well, the best guitar is the one you make yourself.

Barring that, it's the guitar that looks like a midwestern state.

[thesteve]

Originally Posted by CheshireCat

Barring that, it's the guitar that looks like a midwestern state.

Kansas? Iowa? Missouri?

or is Utah somehow part of the midwest now?

[Ryan Freeland]

Yeah. I was wondering that too..

A Colorado-shaped guitar would be interesting. Well... not really.

[CheshireCat]

Originally Posted by Building429_Boy

Yeah. I was wondering that too..

A Colorado-shaped guitar would be interesting. Well... not really.

Utah? Well, it's somewhere between the middle and the west, so I figured that qualified.

Colorado? Already been done:

[sabertooth181]

That is a not very pretty guitar.

I believe I saw a Texas on a billboard in Dallas advertising for a country station.

[CheshireCat]

Originally Posted by sabertooth181

That is a not very pretty guitar.

Dude, that's Bo Diddley!!

I believe I saw a Texas on a billboard in Dallas advertising for a country station.

Actually, I think that was KZPS, the Classic Rock station.

Tho, that said, a guy had a TX guitar at the Dallas Guitar Show. Very sweet. He was looking to sell it, but I thought one state-shaped guitar was enough.

Chesh

[Benny Hicks]

Just get Paul Languedoc to build you one: