what would you do? [Archive] - Christian Guitar Forum

Another Christian

11-06-2001, 04:05 PM

Originally posted by I_Believe
If a muslim boy went up to you, and asked what's the difference between your God, and mine?
What would you say?

There is no difference. We worship the same God. The difference is that Muslims recognize Muhammad as the most recent and strongest prophet, while us Christians believe in the New Testament, and that God's son is Jesus Christ who died for us.

<marquee>It is the same God, just different beliefs.</marquee>

Note: Why didn't you just put "a jewish boy" in light of the attacks? Most everyone is currently characterizing Osama bin Laden and the other terrorists as Muslims, when they don't follow nearly even half of the true Muslim beliefs.

11-06-2001, 04:48 PM

No...
The same God is God of all people because He is God. Yes.

But Muslims don't believe in the same God I do. Their God did not send His son to die for my sins. Mine did.

Xkcer Man

11-06-2001, 05:20 PM

I'd say "My God is loves me enough to be interested in my daily life."

I_Believe

11-06-2001, 05:39 PM

TO: Another Christian...

I didn't put up a jewish boy, because a kid REALLY did come up to me asked that question..hehe

MrCrabby

11-06-2001, 09:29 PM

Well, they believe that what ever happens is the will of Allah, like, the terrorist acts, for instance, they say that if it was allowed to happen, then it was Allah's will.
There are other differences too, i can't remember them though.

Xkcer Man

11-06-2001, 10:00 PM

A lot of Christians believe that, too (except, probably, for the terrorist attacks).

SCCdcTFreak

11-10-2001, 06:29 AM

Okay,

A lot of people have been coming out lately defending the "true" Muslim faith, saying that Osama Bin Laden are not true followers of the Muslim faith, but that's actually NOT the case.

If you were in the Middle East, you would be followed around by "Religious Police" who make sure that you're doing exactly what Muslims are supposed to be doing, like the 5 prayers a day, etc. and if you weren't they'd just start clubbing you in the shins and stuff with police mallets and sticks and stuff.

A majority of the Muslims that leave and come to here are actually leaving so that they don't have to be held to such the strict standards that the Muslims have in the East. They come here, so that if they slip up, they can get away with it and not pay the price for it that they've been taught. Muslim teaches that Christians are wrong, and they are not to be liked and things like that, as well.

Muslim faith also teaches that Massive amounts of "works" are necessary for one to "maintain" their religion. Like, every Muslim believer has to pray 5 times a day, and they have to make a journey to the Middle East at some time in their life. That kinda stinks, 'cuz what if you are like, REALLY devoted to being a Muslim and you're doing the whole 5 prayers a day thing and you have your trip to the Middle East planned for next year. But, you end up getting in a car accident about a month later and you die, never getting the chance to go on the trip. What happens to their believer then? Guess their prayers were useless if they couldn't complete their salvation by going on the trip.

But, in light of the attacks, the P. C. thing for Muslims to do of course, is to come out and say that they are not against Christians and that they do not believe in the Allah that Osama Bin Laden does. And if they're saying this, then they're either lying, or they aren't really as devout in their Muslim faith as their faith teaches them.

Well, that's my $.02. Laters!!

In Him,
† <>< Stephen :cool:

JerryLove

11-10-2001, 12:15 PM

If you were in the Middle East, you would be followed around by "Religious Police" who make sure that you're doing exactly what Muslims are supposed to be doing, like the 5 prayers a day, etc. For most Muslim countries this is between a lie and an exxageration. Religious police do exist in several Muslim countries, but you allowd to be a non-Muslim. They tend to enfoce Muslim bahavior like the Purdah (in countries where Purdah is practiced).

and if you weren't they'd just start clubbing you in the shins and stuff with police mallets and sticks and stuff. Again, while exceptions like Afghanistan exist, this is generally untrue. OTOH, it is well withing Gods law as handed to the Jews.

A majority of the Muslims that leave and come to here are actually leaving so that they don't have to be held to such the strict standards that the Muslims have in the East. They come here, so that if they slip up, they can get away with it and not pay the price for it that they've been taught. Since "slipping up" intentionally takes away their place in paradise, it's hadrly helpful to a believer to change conditions so as to make slipping up easier.

Muslim teaches that Christians are wrong, and they are not to be liked and things like that, as well. Fortunately we have Christians like you, who wouldn't teach that Muslims are wrong and not to be liked, or anything like that huh?

Muslim faith also teaches that Massive amounts of "works" are necessary for one to "maintain" their religion. So does the Christian fatih, if you believe the OT.

That kinda stinks, 'cuz what if you are like, REALLY devoted to being a Muslim and you're doing the whole 5 prayers a day thing and you have your trip to the Middle East planned for next year. But, you end up getting in a car accident about a month later and you die, never getting the chance to go on the trip. What happens to their believer then? They go to heaven. Islam is about subission to the will of God (that's what it means, and Muslim means "one who submits"). If you are too infirm to kneel during prayer, you don't have to kneel. If you cannot afford, or are physically unable to perfrom the Haijj (pilgramige to Mecca) then you are excused from it. If not eating on Ramadan would pose health risks, you are allowed to eat. (as are childrenand the elderly).

And if they're saying this, then they're either lying, or they aren't really as devout in their Muslim faith as their faith teaches them. What, like if you said you believed an a different Jesus than the KKK? Or Aryian church? Or guy bombing abortion clinics? Or crusaders? Or Inquisitors?

Enobmurt

11-10-2001, 03:45 PM

"Okay,

A lot of people have been coming out lately defending the "true" Muslim faith, saying that Osama Bin Laden are not true followers of the Muslim faith, but that's actually NOT the case.

If you were in the Middle East, you would be followed around by "Religious Police" who make sure that you're doing exactly what Muslims are supposed to be doing, like the 5 prayers a day, etc. and if you weren't they'd just start clubbing you in the shins and stuff with police mallets and sticks and stuff.

A majority of the Muslims that leave and come to here are actually leaving so that they don't have to be held to such the strict standards that the Muslims have in the East. They come here, so that if they slip up, they can get away with it and not pay the price for it that they've been taught. Muslim teaches that Christians are wrong, and they are not to be liked and things like that, as well.

Muslim faith also teaches that Massive amounts of "works" are necessary for one to "maintain" their religion. Like, every Muslim believer has to pray 5 times a day, and they have to make a journey to the Middle East at some time in their life. That kinda stinks, 'cuz what if you are like, REALLY devoted to being a Muslim and you're doing the whole 5 prayers a day thing and you have your trip to the Middle East planned for next year. But, you end up getting in a car accident about a month later and you die, never getting the chance to go on the trip. What happens to their believer then? Guess their prayers were useless if they couldn't complete their salvation by going on the trip.

But, in light of the attacks, the P. C. thing for Muslims to do of course, is to come out and say that they are not against Christians and that they do not believe in the Allah that Osama Bin Laden does. And if they're saying this, then they're either lying, or they aren't really as devout in their Muslim faith as their faith teaches them.

Well, that's my $.02. Laters!!

In Him,
† <>< Stephen"

While I'm not sure about the religious police, I do know that Stephen is right about everything else.

I heard a devout Muslim-turn Christian speak at a local church. He had to flee his country and is not put on a warrant to be killed because he turned Christian.

He taught about how Muslims have to work extremely hard for their salvation, and even when they do there is no sure way that Allah would allow them into heaven.

The only forsure way for them to get into heaven is if they commit a righteous act such as suicide bombing and the planes in the world trade centers killing infidels or people inferior to them that are not Muslim.

There are many verses throughout there holy scriptures that say to kill people who renounce their Muslim faith, to kill people who refuse to turn Muslim, just to kill inferiors.

Their god is not the same God because it is not a loving God, it teaches to kill and get rid of inferiors.

Not all muslims are devout though and follow this teaching of killing.

We must not attack Muslims, but love them with the love of our God. That is the way to reach Muslims is to love them.

Enobmurt

11-10-2001, 03:47 PM

sorry...just getting an e-mail notification

Karen M

11-10-2001, 03:58 PM

Hello Eno :)

Sorry, but I don't think you have ever even remotly studied Islam. :(

>>>I heard a devout Muslim-turn Christian speak at a local church. He had to flee his country and is not put on a warrant to be killed because he turned Christian.<<<

Maybe this happens in Afganistan, but they are to the extreme. Ever heard of the Spanish Inquisition? ;) In that, Christians were even scaring out other Christians because they didn't have the exact same faith as them...

>>>He taught about how Muslims have to work extremely hard for their salvation, and even when they do there is no sure way that Allah would allow them into heaven.<<<

Jerry just said in the previous post about how they can get into heaven as long as they submit to their God.

>>>The only forsure way for them to get into heaven is if they commit a righteous act such as suicide bombing and the planes in the world trade centers killing infidels or people inferior to them that are not Muslim.<<<

This is just outright incorrect.

>>>There are many verses throughout there holy scriptures that say to kill people who renounce their Muslim faith, to kill people who refuse to turn Muslim, just to kill inferiors.<<<

Yes, most of it is in the OT, can you think of any other religions based partially on the OT? ;)

>>>Their god is not the same God because it is not a loving God, it teaches to kill and get rid of inferiors.<<<

Their God may not be the same God, but Allah is about as "kind" in manner as the Christian God.

>>>Not all muslims are devout though and follow this teaching of killing.<<<

If you are refurring to the terrorists, its not called being "devout;" its called being an extremist splinter group. For example, if Osama is a "devout" Muslim, then the KKK are "devout" Christians.

Just clearing that up :)

Karen

Chris H

11-10-2001, 04:44 PM

Originally posted by Karen M
[B]
>>>I heard a devout Muslim-turn Christian speak at a local church. He had to flee his country and is not put on a warrant to be killed because he turned Christian.<<<

Maybe this happens in Afganistan, but they are to the extreme. Ever heard of the Spanish Inquisition? ;) In that, Christians were even scaring out other Christians because they didn't have the exact same faith as them...Documented cases exist in several countries where sharia is enforced, of death penalties being handed down, and carried out, for apostasy and blasphemy. It's not just afghanistan, look at iran, sudan, saudia arabia, pakistan and more. Spanish Inquisition was quite a while ago, and it was motivated by power and political struggles. No-one can justify that from scripture.

>>>The only forsure way for them to get into heaven is if they commit a righteous act such as suicide bombing and the planes in the world trade centers killing infidels or people inferior to them that are not Muslim.<<<

This is just outright incorrect.No, it is correct. Islam provides no assurance of entering heaven, except through martyrdom.

>>>There are many verses throughout there holy scriptures that say to kill people who renounce their Muslim faith, to kill people who refuse to turn Muslim, just to kill inferiors.<<<

Yes, most of it is in the OT, can you think of any other religions based partially on the OT? ;)Eh? Most of what is in the OT? Anyhow, didn't think christians tried to put the OT laws into effect nowadays.

>>>Their god is not the same God because it is not a loving God, it teaches to kill and get rid of inferiors.<<<

Their God may not be the same God, but Allah is about as "kind" in manner as the Christian God.Is 'love' ever applied to Allah in the Q'uran?

>>>Not all muslims are devout though and follow this teaching of killing.<<<

If you are refurring to the terrorists, its not called being "devout;" its called being an extremist splinter group. For example, if Osama is a "devout" Muslim, then the KKK are "devout" Christians.Who says that the KKK are christians? Who can justify the acts of the KKK with christian theology? No-one. But many muslims can find theological justification for the recent terrorist acts from islamic texts.

Luke

11-10-2001, 06:27 PM

Originally posted by Chris H
Is 'love' ever applied to Allah in the Q'uran?

Considering they accept the OT, yes.
In the actual Qu'ran, I'm not sure. Maybe.

Chris H

11-10-2001, 06:34 PM

Muslims believe the OT was from Allah, but has been corrupted by man. They won't trust anything from any 'holy' writings unless it is confirmed in the Q'uran or sunnah. A muslim's response to the OT would be along the lines of 'if I want to know the truth of the OT then I'll find it in the Q'uran'.

'Love' is not attributed to the nature of Allah or is used in any of his 'names' (I think they have a list of 99 names for Allah which describe attributes of his nature).

Enobmurt

11-10-2001, 07:27 PM

Hey Karen :)

Sorry, but I don't think you have ever even remotly studied Islam.

I'm sorry, but I believe you haven't studied Islam that deeply. :(

Maybe this happens in Afganistan, but they are to the extreme. Ever heard of the Spanish Inquisition? In that, Christians were even scaring out other Christians because they didn't have the exact same faith as them...

I think Chris answered this pretty well.

Jerry just said in the previous post about how they can get into heaven as long as they submit to their God.
This is just outright incorrect.

Again, Chris answered this pretty well, but I shall ellaborate a little more. Muslims believe they have to work their way into heaven by good deads. When they die, Allah weighs their good works against all their evil deeds, even then though if the good deeds outweigh the bad, there is no assurance that Allah will allow them into heaven except through Martyrdom
You know why the Taliban won't hand over Ladin? It is because Muslims believe that if you kill and infidel, that is no reason for the death penalty and they know we would put Ladin to death.

Yes, most of it is in the OT, can you think of any other religions based partially on the OT?

Most isn't found in the old testament. The only parts they do use of the old testament are the parts they believe match the Q'uran because they believe the Hebrew Testament has been currupt.

Their God may not be the same God, but Allah is about as "kind" in manner as the Christian God.

Can you back this up with scripture from the Q'uran?

If you are refurring to the terrorists, its not called being "devout;" its called being an extremist splinter group. For example, if Osama is a "devout" Muslim, then the KKK are "devout" Christians.

Yeah...Chris answered this one pretty well.

Karen, if you want me to quote some Islamic Text for you, I believe I can dig some up if you like supporting all that has been said.

JerryLove

11-10-2001, 08:13 PM

While I'm not sure about the religious police, I do know that Stephen is right about everything else. Then you continue your pattern of being wrong.

I heard a devout Muslim-turn Christian speak at a local church. He had to flee his country and is not put on a warrant to be killed because he turned Christian. Which country? You cannot take a single statment and apply it to all. Further, it appears that the person in question was a former Muslim now speaking against Islam. That is one of the only three capital offenses in the Quran.

The only forsure way for them to get into heaven is if they commit a righteous act such as suicide bombing and the planes in the world trade centers killing infidels or people inferior to them that are not Muslim. No, but dying for Allah is considered a sure way to heaven, just like dying for Jesus.

There are many verses throughout there holy scriptures that say to kill people who renounce their Muslim faith, to kill people who refuse to turn Muslim, just to kill inferiors.
Their god is not the same God because it is not a loving God, it teaches to kill and get rid of inferiors. Shall I start citing Deuteronimy again?

Documented cases exist in several countries where sharia is enforced, of death penalties being handed down, and carried out, for apostasy and blasphemy. It's not just afghanistan, look at iran, sudan, saudia arabia, pakistan and more. Yes, welcome to the wonderful world of theocracy. Would you like me to start listing non-muslim countries where people were killed in the past 50 years for speaking aout against the government (Phillipines, Cambodia, China, Tibet, Columbia, etc).

Eh? Most of what is in the OT? [QUOTE] The laws demanding death to the poeople of other religions.

[QUOTE]Anyhow, didn't think christians tried to put the OT laws into effect nowadays. No, they have appeard to abandon Gods law, something God commanded should never be done.

Is 'love' ever applied to Allah in the Q'uran? Sure. "Oh son of Adam - so long as you call upon me and ask of me I shall forgive you for what you have done... Were you to come to me with sin as great as the Earth itself, and were you then to face me, ascribing no partner to me, I would forgive you in equal measure" (Hadith Tirmidhi)

Who says that the KKK are christians? Who can justify the acts of the KKK with christian theology? No-one. But many muslims can find theological justification for the recent terrorist acts from islamic texts. They say they are Chrsitian, as do the people that find justification for them.

JerryLove

11-10-2001, 08:17 PM

Muslims believe they have to work their way into heaven by good deads. When they die, Allah weighs their good works against all their evil deeds, even then though if the good deeds outweigh the bad, there is no assurance that Allah will allow them into heaven except through Martyrdom No, they believe that submission to Allah leads to heaven.

You know why the Taliban won't hand over Ladin? It is because Muslims believe that if you kill and infidel, that is no reason for the death penalty and they know we would put Ladin to death. No, because Osama Bin Lauden was a Mujahadeen fighter during the Soviet Occupation and has enough friends that turning against him would destroy their power base. It would also look weak, something else that would destroy their power base.

Most isn't found in the old testament. The only parts they do use of the old testament are the parts they believe match the Q'uran because they believe the Hebrew Testament has been currupt. I can find you plenty of orders to kill infidels and blasphemers and non-virgins, and unruly children, and anyone in your way throughout the OT. Do you really want me to cite those again?

Enobmurt

11-11-2001, 01:10 AM

No, they believe that submission to Allah leads to heaven.

Please cite.

No, because Osama Bin Lauden was a Mujahadeen fighter during the Soviet Occupation and has enough friends that turning against him would destroy their power base. It would also look weak, something else that would destroy their power base.

"Mohammed said: No Muslim should be killed for killing a Kafir (infidel)" - Hadith 9: 50

I can find you plenty of orders to kill infidels and blasphemers and non-virgins, and unruly children, and anyone in your way throughout the OT. Do you really want me to cite those again?

There are no more infidels after Jesus came for he brought the gospel to both Jews and Non Jews as prophecy indicated.

Then you continue your pattern of being wrong.
And you accuse me of being childish?

Which country? You cannot take a single statment and apply it to all. Further, it appears that the person in question was a former Muslim now speaking against Islam. That is one of the only three capital offenses in the Quran.

So you admit it was a Capitol Offense then and that they do have a warrant for his death.

There are four sects of Islam.
1. SUNNI- The majority of Muslims, approximately 90% of Muslims.
2. SHI'ITE- The followers of ALI, who were more militant and about 8% of Muslims worldwide.
3. SUFFI- The 'charasmatics" of Islam, and a very small part of the religion.
4. NATION OF ISLAM- An American derivative, started as the "five-percenters" in Detroit under Timothy Drew Ali.

No, but dying for Allah is considered a sure way to heaven, just like dying for Jesus.

No, but a person dying for Jesus already has a guaranteed salvation without having to do the work of dying for Jesus.

Shall I start citing Deuteronimy again?

Another thread where they talk about laws and their true meaning.

No, they have appeard to abandon Gods law, something God commanded should never be done.

Like the Jews...misunderstanding the true intent of the Laws

They say they are Chrsitian, as do the people that find justification for them.

It still can't be backed up by Christian theology. What protestants are doing to Catholics in Ireland...it cannot be backed up by Christian Theology of love.

As for more on the Islamic teachings..

"Mohammed said: 'I have been ordered to FIGHT with the people till they say, none has the right to be worshipped but Allah." - Hadith 4: 196

"If anyone desires a religion other than Islam, it will NEVER be accepted of him." -Surah 3: 85

"FIGHT those who believe not in Allah nor the last day." Surah 9: 29

"Mohammed's last words were: Turn the Pagans out of the Arabian Peninsula." -Hadith 5: 716

"Mohammed said: Whoever changes his Islamic religion, KILL him." -Hadith 9: 57

"Mohammed said: Know that paradise is under the shades of the sword." Hadith 4: 73

All this compared to the Greatest and most important commandment given to us by Jehovah: Love Mathew 22: 34-40 Mark 12: 28-34

Luke

11-11-2001, 06:49 PM

Relgious persecultion does exist in the Middle East under Islamic governments. This is simply undeniable fact.

Karen M

11-11-2001, 08:27 PM

Eno:

I looked on the internet and I couldn't find any of those quotes :(

However, the Muslims I know are kind, and pasifistic even.

I think what you are bringing up is similar to bringing up the OT laws in the Bible and then you claim somewhere in them Jesus said they didn't count anymore or something(for example, stoning people to death if they talk back to their parents). So, as this is a similar situation, and we don't have a Muslim here to actually defend their religion, I can't explain those. On the other hand, I'm sure they have explainations like the above just like the Bible.

The Islamic scribes across the middle east have all condemned Osama and have claimed that he isn't interpreting the scriptures properly.

Luke:

>>>Relgious persecultion does exist in the Middle East under Islamic governments. This is simply undeniable fact.<<<

Religous persecution has existed across a Christian Europe in prevous centuries. This is simpy undeniable fact. ;)

Happy November,

Karen

Enobmurt

11-11-2001, 09:25 PM

Hey Karen

I think what you are bringing up is similar to bringing up the OT laws in the Bible and then you claim somewhere in them Jesus said they didn't count anymore or something(for example, stoning people to death if they talk back to their parents). So, as this is a similar situation, and we don't have a Muslim here to actually defend their religion, I can't explain those. On the other hand, I'm sure they have explainations like the above just like the Bible.
You might have a point here. I'll keep this possibility open until someone with a better knowledge comes along and explains some possible reasons.

Happy November,

hehe, I like that

Enob

JerryLove

11-11-2001, 10:52 PM

Mohammed said: No Muslim should be killed for killing a Kafir (infidel)" - Hadith 9: 50 The Hadith is not the writing of Muhammed, Hadith 9:50 is the writing of Sahih Al-Bukhari. The actual quote is more specific "no Muslim should be killed in Qisas (equality in punishment) for killing a Kafir (disbeliever)."

There are no more infidels after Jesus came for he brought the gospel to both Jews and Non Jews as prophecy indicated. Wow, there are no unfaithful people? I need to tell some of the atheists.

So you admit it was a Capitol Offense then and that they do have a warrant for his death. I can neither confirm nor deny the validity of your narritive. I can confirm that a former muslim attacking Islam is a capital offense.

Another thread where they talk about laws and their true meaning. You find a better meaning...
"anyone who blasphemes the name of the LORD must be put to death. The entire assembly must stone him. Whether an alien or native-born, when he blasphemes the Name, he must be put to death."

Feel free to explain the misquote and how that is not an instruction to kill anyone who blasphemes.

Like the Jews...misunderstanding the true intent of the Laws Sorry, what was the true intend of the one I cited?

It still can't be backed up by Christian theology. What protestants are doing to Catholics in Ireland...it cannot be backed up by Christian Theology of love. Well gee, you say it can't they say it can. Many muslims say that the terrorists cannot be supported, the terrorists say they can. Sounds like the same song.

From what I have read of both the Bible and the Quran. Both Gods are terrifically malignant and manevolent.

Chris H

11-12-2001, 03:54 AM

Tell you what, once we've defined the true meaning of Islam who will volunteer to tell the muslims? Hehe.

Now, what was the original question..........

Enobmurt

11-12-2001, 04:52 PM

The Hadith is not the writing of Muhammed, Hadith 9:50 is the writing of Sahih Al-Bukhari. The actual quote is more specific "no Muslim should be killed in Qisas (equality in punishment) for killing a Kafir (disbeliever)."

yeah..I just said this.

Wow, there are no unfaithful people? I need to tell some of the atheists.

unfaithful doesn't make people infidels in Christian religion.

"You find a better meaning...
"anyone who blasphemes the name of the LORD must be put to death. The entire assembly must stone him. Whether an alien or native-born, when he blasphemes the Name, he must be put to death."

Feel free to explain the misquote and how that is not an instruction to kill anyone who blasphemes.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Like the Jews...misunderstanding the true intent of the Laws
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sorry, what was the true intend of the one I cited?"

Did I not just say another thread?

Well gee, you say it can't they say it can. Many muslims say that the terrorists cannot be supported, the terrorists say they can. Sounds like the same song.

Jerry...I already went over this...quit being repetitive

JerryLove

11-12-2001, 06:34 PM

yeah..I just said this. No, you cut part. You also claimed it was written by Muhammed.

unfaithful doesn't make people infidels in Christian religion. Infidel -
1 : one who is not a Christian or who opposes Christianity
2 a : an unbeliever with respect to a particular religion b : one who acknowledges no religious belief
3 : a disbeliever in something specified or understood

Did I not just say another thread? You lost me with some of the funny quoting. Please tell me how "anyone who blasphemes the name of the LORD must be put to death. The entire assembly must stone him. Whether an alien or native-born, when he blasphemes the Name, he must be put to death." is not an order to put anyone who blasphemes to death.

Jerry...I already went over this...quit being repetitive You may feel that you have adequately responded to the fact that you say the exact same things (the inquisitors weren't *real* Christians) that the Muslims say (the terrorists aren't *real* Muslims), but basically your answer was "I'm right and they are wrong". You gave no support whatsoever why you have bad Christians aren't real, and bad Muslims are. The closest you came was to say "the Quran is bad", you have yet to address that the Bible is equally bad (as mentioned above).

When you have addressed it sufficiently, or ceded it (or stop making comments that lead to it, then I will stop pounding on it. Until one of those, you have made an assertation that you have failed to support.

Enobmurt

11-12-2001, 07:01 PM

No, you cut part. You also claimed it was written by Muhammed.

I don't remember claiming it was written by Muhammed. The verse says "Muhammed said". That doesn't mean it was written by Muhammed. Just like when the Gospels quote Jesus it doesn't mean they were written by Jesus.

"Infidel -
1 : one who is not a Christian or who opposes Christianity
2 a : an unbeliever with respect to a particular religion b : one who acknowledges no religious belief
3 : a disbeliever in something specified or understood"

Alright, our definitions of infidel differ so let me try putting this in another way.
Christians do not believe they are better than anyone else. In fact we are taught to be less and humble than everyone else like Jesus did. We have no right to kill anyone when we are to be humble to everyone.

Please tell me how "anyone who blasphemes the name of the LORD must be put to death. The entire assembly must stone him. Whether an alien or native-born, when he blasphemes the Name, he must be put to death." is not an order to put anyone who blasphemes to death.

Please take this to the OT thread.

You may feel that you have adequately responded to the fact that you say the exact same things (the inquisitors weren't *real* Christians) that the Muslims say (the terrorists aren't *real* Muslims), but basically your answer was "I'm right and they are wrong". You gave no support whatsoever why you have bad Christians aren't real, and bad Muslims are. The closest you came was to say "the Quran is bad", you have yet to address that the Bible is equally bad (as mentioned above).

Alright, according to religous tolerance.org there are two definitions to being a Christian

"Some fundamentalist Christians believe that the only "true Christian" is a person who has been saved. Probably about 30% of adult Americans are Christians by this definition.

Public opinion polls count a person as a Christian if they describe themselves as Christian. Surveys consistently show that about 87% of adult Americans are Christians in this sense."

You can say that I'm a fundamentalist Christian.

Again, I seem to have come across as saying something I did not mean to imply. I am not meaning or going to state who is a true Muslim or who isn't (if I have, I didn't mean to). I am simply stating what the Islamic doctrines state or teach.

JerryLove

11-12-2001, 07:27 PM

"Alright, our definitions of infidel differ so let me try putting this in another way. "

Meaning yours is different than the official English definitions. I would suggest revising your vocabularity for clarity.

"Christians do not believe they are better than anyone else. In fact we are taught to be less and humble than everyone else like Jesus did. We have no right to kill anyone when we are to be humble to everyone. "

You have a Godly command to do it. Or are you saying that no Christians support capital punishment?

"Please take this to the OT thread. "

Then stop saying I am misquoting, because you have yet to illustrate that.

"Again, I seem to have come across as saying something I did not mean to imply. I am not meaning or going to state who is a true Muslim or who isn't (if I have, I didn't mean to). I am simply stating what the Islamic doctrines state or teach."

You said "A lot of people have been coming out lately defending the "true" Muslim faith, saying that Osama Bin Laden are not true followers of the Muslim faith, but that's actually NOT the case."

Now, if your comment is that Islamic writings support terroism and the Bible does not, then I would, and have, argued against that.